WAR in Ukraine, Putin approves initiation of special military operation (Part 2)

it means no such thing

stop lying, there was no such deal

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Stop ignoring the truth.

Multiple western sources have confirmed the deal.

Russian propaganda, there was no deal and anyone who claims there was is lying

Solutions are easy when you have no skin in the game.

Telling the truth is no lie even with it disagrees with your delusions. Here is an outline of the events related to the agreement with links.

Turkey and Israel were acting as mediators in promising talks to end the war during March 2022.

By the end of March there were multiple reports that a deal was very near.

. . . at the talks on Tuesday in Istanbul, initially slated to last two days, the Ukrainian offer became more explicit, and was delivered in writing. The Ukrainian delegation this time was headed up by the adviser to the president of Ukraine, Mihaylo Podolyak, and the Russian delegation was led by presidential aide Vladimir Medinsky. Kalin had been instrumental in assembling the cast list.
Turkey leads pack of countries vying to mediate between Ukraine and Russia | Turkey | The Guardian

According to the Ukrainian source, Ukrainska Pravda, Boris Johnson intervened to torpedo the deal:

“Johnson brought two simple messages to Kyiv. The first is that Putin is a war criminal; he should be pressured, not negotiated with. And the second is that even if Ukraine is ready to sign some agreements on guarantees with Putin, they are not. We can sign [an agreement] with you [Ukraine], but not with him. Anyway, he will screw everyone over”, is how one of Zelenskyy’s close associates summed up the essence of Johnson’s visit.
From Zelenskyy's ''surrender'' to Putin's surrender: how the negotiations with Russia are going | Ukrainska Pravda

By April 7, Reuters was reporting that that Ukraine had withdrawn its earlier offer.

https://www.reuters.com/world/europe/russia-says-ukraine-presented-unacceptable-draft-peace-deal-2022-04-07/

CNN reported that Boris Johnson was promising a virtual blank check to Ukraine in recent trips to Kyiv.
https://www.cnn.com/2022/04/09/europe/ukraine-uk-boris-johnson-intl-gbr/index.html

CNN in Turkey interviewed the deputy prime minister and he reported that the US and western Europe intervened to prolong the war. Here is a translation from Turkish:

We know that our president is talking to the countries of both leaders. Progress was made on certain issues, the last point was reached, and then suddenly we see that the war is accelerating. With the missile crisis, it has been seen how it can suddenly spiral out of control. This war is not between Russia and Ukraine, it is a war between Russia and the West. By supporting Ukraine, the United States and some countries in Europe are beginning a process of prolonging this war. What we want is an end to this war. Someone is trying not to end the war. The U.S. sees the prolongation of the war as its interest.
https://www.cnnturk.com/video/turkiye/son-dakika-ak-parti-genel-baskanvekili-numan-kurtulmus-cnn-turkte181122

Brookings fellow and former US national-security council member Fiona Hill, co-authored a paper that included details about the negotiations:

According to multiple former senior US officials we spoke with, in April 2022, Russian and Ukrainian negotiators appeared to have tentatively agreed on the outlines of a negotiated interim settlement: Russia would withdraw to its position on February 23, when it controlled part of the Donbass region and all of Crimea, and in exchange, Ukraine would promise not to seek NATO membership and instead receive security guarantees from a number of countries. . .
The World Putin Wants

The former Israeli PM who was involved in the negotiations has a similar story:

Calling both leaders “pragmatic,” Bennett says that over the course of negotiations, he “was under the impression that both sides very much want[ed] a ceasefire” and gave the odds of any deal holding at 50-50. Over a “marathon of drafts,” he claims, seventeen draft agreements were prepared. But “they blocked it, and I thought [they were] wrong,” Bennett says, referring to the Western powers backing Ukraine.

“I have one claim,” Bennett told the interviewer. “I claim there was a good chance of reaching a ceasefire.” When the interviewer asks if he means “had they not curbed it,” he replies with a nod.
The Grinding War in Ukraine Could Have Ended a Long Time Ago

Putin recently provided details of the draft agreement.
https://www.rt.com/russia/578220-putin-ukraine-neutrality-plan/

The war should have ended in April 2022. Instead the warmongers in Washington and London demanded that the war continue.

Pavlyna Orlova, 34, stands by a picture of her husband, Volodymr, 33, who was killed Oct. 20, 2022. His photo is posted with hundreds of other Ukrainian soldiers’ at Saints Peter and Paul Garrison Church. (Marcus Yam / Los Angeles Times)
In Ukraine, a harvest of death as bodies of the fallen are returned to their hometowns

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Isn’t that the same kind of lame response that progs post when they just troll with… “link?”

No debate. No facts. Just the troll post… “Russian propaganda” followed by a statement and “proof by belligerent assertion”.

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No not a stalemate

According to Business Insider and WaPo Ukraine is abandoning western tanks because they just keep getting blowed up in the minefields and are attacking on foot, ya that don’t sound like winning.

Ukraine has been forced to change its counteroffensive strategy after repeatedly coming up against dense Russian minefields, a report says.

Ukrainian units are leaving behind the battle tanks and infantry fighting vehicles donated by Western allies and advancing slowly on foot, The Washington Post reported.

“You can no longer do anything with just a tank with some armor because the minefield is too deep, and sooner or later, it will stop, and then it will be destroyed by concentrated fire,” Ukraine’s commander-in-chief General Valery Zaluzhny told The Post.

The minefields have exposed the limitations of Western-provided armor, which Ukraine had long been requesting to help in its fight to take back territory occupied by Russia.

So they are abandoning their vehicles walking across the minefields while Russia has complete air superiority and according to the article, Russia is dropping mines from the air behind the troops that have advanced so if they retreat they have to retreat back through new minefields :thinking: What’s it going to take to see this is at best a stalemate unless everyone is ok with reading weekly Biden has just send another billion dollar that we don’t have aid package to the Ukraine for what looks like no end in site, as every military analysist has stated this conflict as an artillery war at which the main general of Ukraine himself says Russia has a 10-1 advantage in artillery.

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That’s the thing about wars … they seldom go the way they should.

Perhaps Senator Graham can send a thank you note to Mrs. Orlova and the other Ukrainian widows.

“Best Money We’ve Ever Spent.”
https://twitter.com/KevinRothrock/status/1662813534537891840

It’s a war … one that Russia started … people die in wars … lots of them.

The neocon lust to destroy Russia has instead destroyed Ukraine. Washington continues to use the puppet state in Kyiv to send barely trained Ukrainian conscripts on suicidal offensives in eastern Ukraine.

“Best Money We’ve Ever Spent.”

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Russia doesn’t need the neocons to destroy them. They are doing a fine job of it all on their own.

This is the Battle of the Somme 2.0 for the Ukrainian conscripts.

No it’s not. Not even close.

Should they be?

Cluster bombs have been banned by over 100 countries due to the significant risk they pose to civilian populations. These munitions release smaller bomblets that have a high failure rate, leaving unexploded remnants that can remain dangerous for years and detonate unpredictably, BBC News cited.

But that does not support the war mongers narrative.

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Hey, Zskyy and NATO are helping Russia promote global warming.

It takes two or three to tango nowadays.

What do you know about cluster bombs anyway?

Let us study the Vietnam War, where Vietnam, Laos, and Cambodia were heavily targeted with cluster bombs. Several decades later, the specter of cluster bombs still looms over these three countries.

“Putin provided”

bwahahahahahahahaha

Russian propaganda. Nothing more.

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seeing as how it was my job durring my career to plan and execute fires…

a lot more than you which doesn’t take much since you doon’t even seem to know the difference between a “bomb” and a “round”