Post-Trump's presidency (practical vs idealistic)

Call_me_Ishmael · December 17, 2018, 2:12am

“Whataboutery” is a simple integrity test.
Why don’t you care?

Bomberfox · December 17, 2018, 2:53am

Nope. Its a tu quoque fallacy that the soviets used to use. You wanna be a good comrade? Start a thread or stay on topic.

Call_me_Ishmael · December 17, 2018, 3:14am

Yep…

Hahahahaha… some learn a little Latin and then they try to quote it. “Tu quoque.” They get excited when they think they can quote it. It’s funny really.

But you see, referencing the past for comparison is a fallacy only if one uses such references of the past to discredit the original statement. Then it’s a tu quoque fallacy.

The original statement may even be true. But -now listen closely so that you don’t make the same mistake in the future- a hypocrite is still a hypocrite even if they make a true assertion today but failed to make a comparable assertion regarding the past event that is used as a reference.

So
Whataboutism is not trying to refute the statement…it’s just testing to see if the statement -true or not - is being made by someone with integrity.

Bomberfox · December 17, 2018, 3:16am

I never said it was the same, whataboutery is a dodge to try to shift taking responsibility by saying what about this? This is an internet forum. Calm yer ass down.

Call_me_Ishmael · December 17, 2018, 3:21am

Cratic3947:

SaysWho:

So let’s just ignore the people with their heads in the sand for a bit and all acknowledge that Trump clearly cheated to some degree to get elected. Let’s discuss what he’s done and what should be undone (if anything) both from a practical POV and from an idealistic POV.

Idealistically, everything he’s done and everyone he’s appointed should be wiped out and let go. Obviously that’s not happening because the alt-right has already threatened violence if they sense a coup and for some reason we are afraid of them(?).

But realistically what will be done and do you agree with it.

Some issues I see:

Hillary’s association with Bill was a bigger liability than anything Trump did, so just because he cheated there’s no safe assurance that she would have won.

Same above for the Comey letter.

Just because Trump is illegitimate doesn’t mean some arbitrary Democrat/Republican should be appointed. But how far down does knowledge or complicity go in our chain of succession. If we hit Pelosi, the alt-right will again threaten violence.

I think realistically the only thing that should be wiped out are his judges. Gorsuch is already illegitimate due to McConnell and Kavanaugh is both morally unfit and unimpressive to conservatives anyway.

I think we should focus on the justices and nominate in a liberal to replace Gorsuch and a morally fit moderate conservative to replace Kavanaugh. The latter only for practical political reasons, not because it’s right.

If you think nothing Trump did should be undone, I’ll assume you believe he’s innocent of any electoral misconduct and will revisit your opinion when he is eventually proven guilty.

I bet the OP thinks Russians changed votes.

Hey, did Hillary get the questions ahead of time?.. Yes, so that’s cheating…LMAO.

Not one example of Trump cheating. How do dems lie to themselves like this? Must take practice…lol!

They are still grieving from November 2016. I think they are only at the “resistance” stage. Their dream of a swamp creature for president died in 2016. They dreamed of a lawyer, a politician, an experienced slimeball or - OMG - a woman who is all three…ANYTHING but Trump! And the negative energy that is their response to the shock event that started in all has not peaked yet. It will go more negative next year.