It's Official: US auto dealers from every automaker oppose Biden's Eco agenda. (The same one automakers are abandoning as fast as they can.)

EVs are like TikTock data dumps.

:point_up: Rationalization for a failing policy. :wink:

Engines can be repaired. Batteries must be replaced.

Yes. Engines are rarely replaced to keep a car on the road, Batteries always have to be replaced to do so.

My 13-yr-old gasoline powered pick-up truck has never had a mechanical failure. If it were an EV, I would be looking at replacing the battery pack (to the tune of $15-20,000) within three years.

Interestingly, the only replacement parts my truck has needed In these 13 years are a headlight bulb and … the battery. :wink:

Some can be rebuilt. The Prius 2nd Gen battery pack has companies that refurbish the cells (they reuse the plastic and metal casing for each cell) and sell them as a kit. You take the hybrid battery case apart and then replace each cell individually. They’re numbered for where they need to go. Considering how cheap 2nd gen Priuses are to buy with bad hybrid batteries it’s actually very affordable to do yourself.

Of course not all battery backs are designed that way. Most of them are completely sealed. Teslas for example.

To be fair, your Tacoma has the 1GR-FSE in it. The most reliable engine Toyota ever made. Those things are unnaturally reliable.

Most engines aren’t that well designed. They’re good but it’s not uncommon to have to do major engine work by 200K miles on most engines. Usually timing or valve train related.

Or if you’re a poor soul that buys a 2023 Silverado you’ll be removing your camshaft and heads within 20,000 miles. Since they are so prone to lifter collapse and cam failure.

That’s true, but a factory refurbishment of a battery pack is not a repair, it’s recycling. When your EV battery pack fails, neither your mechanic nor the dealer can fix it.

True. And even then it’s cost prohibitive to change the pack yourself on most EVs. Most of them are used as structural members in the car. That’s how Tesla does it. So a battery swap is a crazy process on those cars.

It’s smart use of the battery’s weight and mass but it makes it impossible to replace yourself. Unless you own a frame jig I guess.

Although some engine swaps are kind of nuts. Like Ford super duty trucks. Got to remove the cab from the frame. Good luck doing that at the house lol.

They’re also much friendlier in terms of rare earth metal use because the battery packs only have to be a fraction of the size. Which means way less lithium and cobalt needs to be used for each battery.

The Rav-4 Prime is a nuts little vehicle. My girlfriend wants one as her next car. In EV mode it has a range of 60 miles. So more than enough for her daily commute and the battery pack is small enough to realistically recharge over night on my external 120 volt outlet. But it has a gas engine and decent size fuel tank as well. Total range is about 450 miles between both EV mode and hybrid drive mode. So good enough for long trips.

Most of the cars I have owned, I ran for over ten years. My '88 Mazda PU, I ran for 22 years and my '82 Volvo I had for 32 years and the kid who bought it ran it for another 5-6 before he sold it. As far as I know, it’s still on the road. I have never had an engine failure in 60 years of owning cars except in a 1976 B210 that for some unknown reason blew out all the oil without the oil light coming on and seized up. Cost me only $1000 to have it rebuilt. There certainly are and have been some lemon engines, but engine failure is rarely the reason cars leave the road.

Yeah. I’ve only had one bad motor. 1ZZ-FE in a 2000 Celica that had been heavily abused. Technically I could have just pulled the head off and re ringed the engine since that was the issue. But I was afraid I’d get in there and discover more issues. So I just bought a cheap used motor out of a Corolla and swapped it. Very convenient that Toyota used that engine in a million different cars. So I only paid like 500 bucks for it.

Even with the high shop fees these days, labor to replace the battery pack is the least of your costs. And they don’t stock battery packs in the parts room either. You have to order it and wait your turn for delivery. Fortunately, most EV batteries give you some warning as to when they must be replaced giving you time to get a replacement without forcing you to park it while you wait.

Very true.

In my personal experience the number one thing that leaves ICEs randomly on the side of the road are engine electronics. Specifically camshaft position sensors and crankshaft position sensors. That’s our number one and number 2 selling items in the parts industry lol. Computer doesn’t get a reading and basically says “I have no ■■■■■■■ clue what this engine speed is turning at” and the engine just shuts off.

Thankfully most are easy to replace and very cheap. Unless it’s a crank sensor on a 99-04 Nissan Frontier V6. I had that problem. And discovered it required pulling the damn passengers side exhaust manifold off on the side of the road. That ■■■■ sucked.

I see what you did there and it won’t work. :sunglasses:

Toward the latter years that we owned that '82 Volvo, it went through a phase where it just didn’t want to run quit right no matter what we did for it. Then one day, my wife did an abrupt down-shift and it just quit running. I had it towed to the shop and they determined that the engine breaking by the down-shift had caused the timing belt (which was near replacement mileage) to slip a couple of cogs. A new belt and she was good to go. Apparently, those months of poor running performance was the belt being one cog off.

The biggest repeating problem I had with that car was the clutch cable would slip at the transmission end, leaving you very suddenly without clutch, usually in traffic at an intersection. That happened three times in my 32 years with her. Worst problem though was the thermostat on the air intake (Volvo routes combustion air over the exhaust manifold to speed engine warm up) failed, which caused the hot wire air-fuel sensor and oxygen sensor to go out. It was an easy diagnosis for my mechanic and a simple fix, but that hot wire sensor cost $600 (twenty years ago.)

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No, I don’t- I routinely receive emails like this from PSEG:
Congratulations! You are spending about the same amount on electricity as the most energy efficient households in your area and less on gas. That came yesterday,

It doesn’t use much electricity because it is a hybrid.

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You could actually buy another ICE vehicle. :rofl:

I’ve looked into the Toyota Corolla Cross. Very efficient and remarkably affordable. Not impressed with the interior options but much more practical than this ‘Ol 2005 Mercedes Benz ML 500. V-8 powered tank that might make 13 mpg on a good day. :face_with_raised_eyebrow:
We’re still not ready to pull the trigger.

Mine’s a Toyota Rav 4 Prime, which is slightly bigger than the Corolla. We were not ready to go full electric just yet, so it’s a good compromise.

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That does not say that you are not using a lot of electricity, it says you are paying the same amount as people pay for gas.

PSEG could also be lying.