Canadian truckers’ ‘Freedom Convoy'

[WuWei]

@TheDoctorIsIn

@WuWei

People with no interest in comparing intelligence probably shouldn’t call other people unintelligent or defend those who do.

Why not?

It’s not very logical.

[Samm]

@biggestal99

@Samm

You’re a doctor (presumably.) Ron Paul is a doctor. How do you compare to Allan?

Schooling or your career choice has nothing to do with innate intelligence.

■■■■■■■■■ It’s a strong indicator.

[Samm]

@Jezcoe

@Samm

Again, the protein changed, which is why the vaccine that was designed for the original form, was less effective with Delta and even less so against Omicron. The virus probably changed too, which would account for it’s lower lethality, but the fact remains that the vaccine does not produce antiviral Tcells … only those viruses that manage to infect your cells do that.

Where do you get this from?

It is just so wrong.

I got it from the NIH and the CDC. Where did you get your misinformation from?

[Samm]

@Jezcoe

@Samm

You calling it nonsense does not make it so. The fact is, the mRNA vaccines contain NO virus, they only contain a replica of the protein. The vaccine causes the immune system to produce antibodies that recognize and attach to the spikes on the protein which prevents it from invading the cells. Without being able to invade the cells where it can reproduce, the virus is expelled from your body which is why you can be infectious for several days after exposure without ever being infected.

But I agree, you thinking you are immune is dumb.

No no no no no no no.

That is not how it works.

Really. Where are you getting this?

mRNA vaccine-induced antibodies more effective than natural immunity in neutralizing SARS-CoV-2 and its high affinity variants | Scientific Reports

Data further revealed that the samples from mRNA vaccinated individuals had a median of 17 times higher RBD antibody levels and a similar degree of increased neutralization activities against RBD-ACE2 binding than those from natural infections. Our data showed that N501Y RBD had fivefold higher ACE2 binding than the original variant. While some antisera from naturally infected subjects had substantially reduced neutralization ability against N501Y RBD, all blood samples from vaccinated individuals were highly effective in neutralizing it. Thus, our data indicates that mRNA vaccination may generate more neutralizing RBD antibodies than natural immunity. It further suggests a potential need to maintain high RBD antibody levels to control the more infectious SARS-CoV-2 variants.

Yes … the vaccine is very good at preventing the protein from entering our cells and releasing the virus contained within.

Tell me, how can a person who is immune to a viral disease, communicate that virus to other people? Yet the CDC tells us that vaccinated people still present a threat to other people, so wear a mask … two masks are better than one.

We are way off topic here … let it go.

[Jezcoe]

@Samm

@Jezcoe

@Samm

Again, the protein changed, which is why the vaccine that was designed for the original form, was less effective with Delta and even less so against Omicron. The virus probably changed too, which would account for it’s lower lethality, but the fact remains that the vaccine does not produce antiviral Tcells … only those viruses that manage to infect your cells do that.

Where do you get this from?

It is just so wrong.

I got it from the NIH and the CDC. Where did you get your misinformation from?

Then please show me the part where they state that the antibodies that are made by the vaccine are different than that one’s made by infection.

That once an immune response is provoked, that the antibodies produced will be somehow different.

Please show that to me.

[Samm]

No. It doesn’t matter … particularly to this thread.

Let it go.

[biggestal99]

@TheDoctorIsIn

There were supposed to be two convoys - the “People’s Convoy” and the “Freedom Convoy USA.”

The “Freedom Convoy USA” is the one that was supposed to reach DC for the SOTU, but fizzled around Las Vegas because only 5 trucks showed up.

The “People’s Convoy” is apparently still en route.

It’s like the immigration caravans. They pick up and lose people en route.

Allan

[Jezcoe]

@Samm

@Jezcoe

@Samm

You calling it nonsense does not make it so. The fact is, the mRNA vaccines contain NO virus, they only contain a replica of the protein. The vaccine causes the immune system to produce antibodies that recognize and attach to the spikes on the protein which prevents it from invading the cells. Without being able to invade the cells where it can reproduce, the virus is expelled from your body which is why you can be infectious for several days after exposure without ever being infected.

But I agree, you thinking you are immune is dumb.

No no no no no no no.

That is not how it works.

Really. Where are you getting this?

mRNA vaccine-induced antibodies more effective than natural immunity in neutralizing SARS-CoV-2 and its high affinity variants | Scientific Reports

Data further revealed that the samples from mRNA vaccinated individuals had a median of 17 times higher RBD antibody levels and a similar degree of increased neutralization activities against RBD-ACE2 binding than those from natural infections. Our data showed that N501Y RBD had fivefold higher ACE2 binding than the original variant. While some antisera from naturally infected subjects had substantially reduced neutralization ability against N501Y RBD, all blood samples from vaccinated individuals were highly effective in neutralizing it. Thus, our data indicates that mRNA vaccination may generate more neutralizing RBD antibodies than natural immunity. It further suggests a potential need to maintain high RBD antibody levels to control the more infectious SARS-CoV-2 variants.

Yes … the vaccine is very good at preventing the protein from entering our cells and releasing the virus contained within.

Tell me, how can a person who is immune to a viral disease, communicate that virus to other people? Yet the CDC tells us that vaccinated people still present a threat to other people, so wear a mask … two masks are better than one.

We are way off topic here … let it go.

The vaccine is not 100% and there is a certain percentage chance of a breakthrough infection.

None of this is controversial.

What is weird is the notion that the antibodies produced by vaccination are inherently different than those from exposure to the virus.

[Jezcoe]

@Samm

No.

Let it go.

Because you can’t.

[Samm]

Says the guy who can’t let it go.

[Jezcoe]

@Samm

Says the guy who can’t let it go.

You keep bringing it up.

And as long as that happens there will be push back.

[zantax]

@Jezcoe

@Samm

@Jezcoe

@Samm

Again, the protein changed, which is why the vaccine that was designed for the original form, was less effective with Delta and even less so against Omicron. The virus probably changed too, which would account for it’s lower lethality, but the fact remains that the vaccine does not produce antiviral Tcells … only those viruses that manage to infect your cells do that.

Where do you get this from?

It is just so wrong.

I got it from the NIH and the CDC. Where did you get your misinformation from?

Then please show me the part where they state that the antibodies that are made by the vaccine are different than that one’s made by infection.

That once an immune response is provoked, that the antibodies produced will be somehow different.

Please show that to me.

You develop antibodies to all parts of the virus with naturally acquired immunity, not just the spike protein. That is why it does better than the vaccine against variants.

from https://thehill.com/opinion/healthcare/592457-the-cdc-is-finally-recognizing-natural-immunity-legislators-should-follow

In contrast, during a natural infection, the human body is exposed to all parts of the virus, including the spike protein. When the immune system responds to enable recovery from the infection, it is broader and more diverse, with a greater ability to defend against any future SARS-CoV-2 virus variants.

Therefore, while mutations naturally form in the SARS-CoV-2 spike protein through the process of viral evolution, the targeted vaccine-based approach to attack the spike protein, while still effective, is not as robust as the armamentarium created from surviving a true infection, and most effective in combination with vaccination.

[Samm]

Push back? I’d call it plain old stubbornness.

[Jezcoe]

@zantax

@Jezcoe

@Samm

@Jezcoe

@Samm

Again, the protein changed, which is why the vaccine that was designed for the original form, was less effective with Delta and even less so against Omicron. The virus probably changed too, which would account for it’s lower lethality, but the fact remains that the vaccine does not produce antiviral Tcells … only those viruses that manage to infect your cells do that.

Where do you get this from?

It is just so wrong.

I got it from the NIH and the CDC. Where did you get your misinformation from?

Then please show me the part where they state that the antibodies that are made by the vaccine are different than that one’s made by infection.

That once an immune response is provoked, that the antibodies produced will be somehow different.

Please show that to me.

You develop antibodies to all parts of the virus with naturally acquired immunity, not just the spike protein. That is why it does better than the vaccine against variants.

from https://thehill.com/opinion/healthcare/592457-the-cdc-is-finally-recognizing-natural-immunity-legislators-should-follow

In contrast, during a natural infection, the human body is exposed to all parts of the virus, including the spike protein. When the immune system responds to enable recovery from the infection, it is broader and more diverse, with a greater ability to defend against any future SARS-CoV-2 virus variants.

Therefore, while mutations naturally form in the SARS-CoV-2 spike protein through the process of viral evolution, the targeted vaccine-based approach to attack the spike protein, while still effective, is not as robust as the armamentarium created from surviving a true infection, and most effective in combination with vaccination.

And the article that was linked with that statement was about hybrid immunity of vaccination and immunity gained through exposure. It has to do with the longevity of plasmablasts post exposure and the robustness of B memory cells.

The way the virus interacts with the body is through the spike protein. Infection produces antibodies that attack the protein. Vaccination produces antibodies that attack the spike protein.

The statement that the vaccination absolutely does not prevent infection is silly.

It confers a percentage chance of lower risk of infection that wanes with time.

Just like when one is exposed and gets sick with the virus.

[Samm]

@Jezcoe

The way the virus interacts with the body is through the spike protein. Infection produces antibodies that attack the protein. Vaccination produces antibodies that attack the spike protein.

There ya go. That’s what I’ve been telling you. The vaccine produces antibodies that attack (attach to the receptors preventing it from attaching to our cells so the virus can infect them) the spiked protein NOT THE VIRUS. The antiviral antibodies are produced by the immune system when (because the vaccine is not 100% effective against the protein) cells are infected by the virus itself.

So we’re done here, right?

[Jezcoe]

@Samm

@Jezcoe

The way the virus interacts with the body is through the spike protein. Infection produces antibodies that attack the protein. Vaccination produces antibodies that attack the spike protein.

There ya go. That’s what I’ve been telling you. The vaccine produces antibodies that attack (attach to the receptors preventing it from attaching to our cells so the virus can infect them) the spiked protein NOT THE VIRUS. The antiviral antibodies are produced by the immune system when (because the vaccine is not 100% effective against the protein) cells are infected by the virus itself.

So we’re done here, right?

The spike protein is part of the virus.

They cannot be separated.

And plus I mistyped.

I meant to write that infection produces antibodies that attack the spike protein.

I have said this before if there is any question.

[Samm]

[Jezcoe]

@Samm

Yeah. I mistyped.

Here is a previous post.

Canadian truckers’ ‘Freedom Convoy'

Actually, it’s the only way. The vaccine protects you (in varying degrees) from the virus, but it does not make you immune. It does grant immunity for a period of time that wanes. No … it does not. There are no antiviral antibodies produced by the vaccine. The antibodies created by the vaccine are entirely aimed at the protein coating around the virus. Thats why the CDC changed the definition of vaccine from “immunity” to “protection” … because the vaccine protects (but not necessaril…

[zantax]

@Jezcoe

@Samm

@Jezcoe

The way the virus interacts with the body is through the spike protein. Infection produces antibodies that attack the protein. Vaccination produces antibodies that attack the spike protein.

There ya go. That’s what I’ve been telling you. The vaccine produces antibodies that attack (attach to the receptors preventing it from attaching to our cells so the virus can infect them) the spiked protein NOT THE VIRUS. The antiviral antibodies are produced by the immune system when (because the vaccine is not 100% effective against the protein) cells are infected by the virus itself.

So we’re done here, right?

The spike protein is part of the virus.

They cannot be separated.

And plus I mistyped.

I meant to write that infection produces antibodies that attack the spike protein.

I have said this before if there is any question.

No, as the article I linked stated, in natural acquired immunity you get antibodies to most parts of the virus, not just the spike protein.

[Jezcoe]

@zantax

@Jezcoe

@Samm

@Jezcoe

The way the virus interacts with the body is through the spike protein. Infection produces antibodies that attack the protein. Vaccination produces antibodies that attack the spike protein.

There ya go. That’s what I’ve been telling you. The vaccine produces antibodies that attack (attach to the receptors preventing it from attaching to our cells so the virus can infect them) the spiked protein NOT THE VIRUS. The antiviral antibodies are produced by the immune system when (because the vaccine is not 100% effective against the protein) cells are infected by the virus itself.

So we’re done here, right?

The spike protein is part of the virus.

They cannot be separated.

And plus I mistyped.

I meant to write that infection produces antibodies that attack the spike protein.

I have said this before if there is any question.

No, as the article I linked stated, in natural acquired immunity you get antibodies to most parts of the virus, not just the spike protein.

What other parts?