Can you hate the sin without hating the sinner?

[Optrader]

@AZslim

@Optrader

@TheDoctorIsIn

@Optrader

This is an opinions forum. I recognize the limitations a forum has. On the one hand, we can take time to think about a response and say what we want to say, but on the other hand, the personal interaction is missing and that is critical in reaching people whether it’s preaching or any other topic.

I don’t really understand what you’re trying to say here.

As an unbeliever, sometimes there are aspects of the conversation that I’m not sure I understand. Which is why I tend to ask a lot of questions.

@Optrader

Why do you come to the RF if you are an unbeliever?

Because religion has always fascinated me. I come in good faith - I’m not attacking or making fun of anyone.

I am a fundamentalist. Primarily because I don’t trust anyone to have a lock on the truth. My eternity is too important to me to not know for myself. God hasn’t made any personal appearances in a couple thousand years, so if the writings he inspired and preserved can’t be trusted we’re doomed.

There are truths which Jesus commissioned Christians to impart to the world. In fact, to go and teach all things that he taught was the last command he gave the Apostles before he ascended to heaven. I post here and talk face to face with a lot of people and I find most people have no interest. What do you, as a non believer, find offensive about Christianity, the message or the messenger? Do you make a distinction?

The message that all who don’t believe as you do will be tortured for eternity is offensive.

People hated Jesus and eventually killed him. He said, about his followers " If they hate me, they will hate you." Jesus was very clear about the eternal fate of the unrepentant.

[SixFoot]

He/Introspection throws me helpful hints before I do something as to whether or not it’s something I would do unto myself. We laugh reflect a lot when we commune. God is lonely like that.

[Optrader]

@TheDoctorIsIn

@Optrader

What do you, as a non believer, find offensive about Christianity, the message or the messenger? Do you make a distinction?

I find nothing at all offensive about Christianity. I like Christianity. I like most Christians, too.

I just don’t believe.

Have you asked yourself why? Why do believers believe and you don’t?

[TheDoctorIsIn]

@Optrader

People hated Jesus and eventually killed him. He said, about his followers " If they hate me, they will hate you." Jesus was very clear about the eternal fate of the unrepentant.

There is a difference between hate and disbelief.

You appear to be conflating the two.

[TheDoctorIsIn]

@Optrader

Have you asked yourself why? Why do believers believe and you don’t?

Of course. I ask myself that question all the time.

That’s why I’m so fascinated by religion.

[Optrader]

@SixFoot

He/Introspection throws me helpful hints before I do something as to whether or not it’s something I would do unto myself. We laugh reflect a lot when we commune. God is lonely like that.

We can sin against ourselves without sinning against others and yet the sin is just as deadly. Are you introspective about those?

[AZslim]

@Optrader

@TheDoctorIsIn

@Optrader

What do you, as a non believer, find offensive about Christianity, the message or the messenger? Do you make a distinction?

I find nothing at all offensive about Christianity. I like Christianity. I like most Christians, too.

I just don’t believe.

Have you asked yourself why? Why do believers believe and you don’t?

I think it’s because they aren’t able to deal with death.

[SixFoot]

@Optrader

@SixFoot

He/Introspection throws me helpful hints before I do something as to whether or not it’s something I would do unto myself. We laugh reflect a lot when we commune. God is lonely like that.

We can sin against ourselves without sinning against others and yet the sin is just as deadly. Are you introspective about those?

There is no difference between sinning against others and sinning against the self. Sin is sin, choice is choice. You are one alternative in an endless number of alternatives to address the loneliness of existing. The rules are rigid, and the reference is hearsay. Your purpose is to find purpose.

[Optrader]

@TheDoctorIsIn

@Optrader

People hated Jesus and eventually killed him. He said, about his followers " If they hate me, they will hate you." Jesus was very clear about the eternal fate of the unrepentant.

There is a difference between hate and disbelief.

You appear to be conflating the two.

Hatred often goes both ways. Within this thread, I have already been told that telling people that unbelievers go to Hell is a message of hate. Yet, if I hated someone and believed they will go to hell, wouldn’t it
be more hateful and make more sense for me to say nothing at all and let them go to hell without warning?

I don’t hate anyone. I am called to warn people, yet people often hate the messenger.

[mobulis]

@Optrader

@mobulis

@Optrader

@TheDoctorIsIn

@Optrader

This is an opinions forum. I recognize the limitations a forum has. On the one hand, we can take time to think about a response and say what we want to say, but on the other hand, the personal interaction is missing and that is critical in reaching people whether it’s preaching or any other topic.

I don’t really understand what you’re trying to say here.

As an unbeliever, sometimes there are aspects of the conversation that I’m not sure I understand. Which is why I tend to ask a lot of questions.

@Optrader

Why do you come to the RF if you are an unbeliever?

Because religion has always fascinated me. I come in good faith - I’m not attacking or making fun of anyone.

I am a fundamentalist. Primarily because I don’t trust anyone to have a lock on the truth. My eternity is too important to me to not know for myself. God hasn’t made any personal appearances in a couple thousand years, so if the writings he inspired and preserved can’t be trusted we’re doomed.

There are truths which Jesus commissioned Christians to impart to the world. In fact, to go and teach all things that he taught was the last command he gave the Apostles before he ascended to heaven. I post here and talk face to face with a lot of people and I find most people have no interest. What do you, as a non believer, find offensive about Christianity, the message or the messenger? Do you make a distinction?

Since those writings were written by man then yep we’re doomed.

Penned by men, inspired by God. Stylistically the authors of the various books are very different. God didn’t dictate word for word what he wanted. He inspired the men through time that possessed a truth he wanted preserved, and let them put it in their words. There are many recorded direct quotes, especially those of Jesus, but everything as a whole is one consistent record of God and his interaction with people and his means of redeeming us.

Then there are mistakes and bias in the text.

[Optrader]

@AZslim

@Optrader

@TheDoctorIsIn

@Optrader

What do you, as a non believer, find offensive about Christianity, the message or the messenger? Do you make a distinction?

I find nothing at all offensive about Christianity. I like Christianity. I like most Christians, too.

I just don’t believe.

Have you asked yourself why? Why do believers believe and you don’t?

I think it’s because they aren’t able to deal with death.

I think Christians deal with death very well. I’ve been to many Christian and non Christian funerals and there is a big difference in Christians. They are sad, but also know a reunion is coming. In unbelievers I have seen people in unconsolable grief. For them, they believe it’s a final, permanent goodbye.

[TheDoctorIsIn]

@Optrader

Hatred often goes both ways. Within this thread, I have already been told that telling people that unbelievers go to Hell is a message of hate.

It’s not a “message of hate”. It certainly can feel insulting, though - as an unbeliever.

It certainly doesn’t endear me to your particular variety of Christianity.

I have not accused you of hating anyone. I am not responsible for anyone else’s posts but my own, and I have not accused you of anything, or attacked or mocked you in any way.

[TheDoctorIsIn]

You are making his point for him.

I am not scared of a final permanent goodbye. If I return to the earth tomorrow, it’ll still have been worth it.

[Optrader]

I appreciate the input so far. It’s late for me now so I’m off till tomorrow…

Good comments and questions giving me much to think about! Thanks to all.

[TheDoctorIsIn]

Good night!

[AZslim]

@Optrader

@AZslim

@Optrader

@TheDoctorIsIn

@Optrader

What do you, as a non believer, find offensive about Christianity, the message or the messenger? Do you make a distinction?

I find nothing at all offensive about Christianity. I like Christianity. I like most Christians, too.

I just don’t believe.

Have you asked yourself why? Why do believers believe and you don’t?

I think it’s because they aren’t able to deal with death.

I think Christians deal with death very well. I’ve been to many Christian and non Christian funerals and there is a big difference in Christians. They are sad, but also know a reunion is coming. In unbelievers I have seen people in unconsolable grief. For them, they believe it’s a final, permanent goodbye.

Yes. They deal with death well because they believe they will go someplace nice after they die. A common theme among religions.

Join our club and you don’t really die.

[Guvnah]

@TheDoctorIsIn

It certainly can feel insulting, though - as an unbeliever.

Choose to believe.

[TheDoctorIsIn]

Why?

123

[ImRightYoureWrong]

@BonAppetit

This is not what Christians think!

The OP believes it im pretty sure

[ImRightYoureWrong]

@Optrader

Hatred often goes both ways. Within this thread, I have already been told that telling people that unbelievers go to Hell is a message of hate. Yet, if I hated someone and believed they will go to hell, wouldn’t it
be more hateful and make more sense for me to say nothing at all and let them go to hell without warning?

I don’t hate anyone. I am called to warn people, yet people often hate the messenger.

Do you think people deserve it? Do you endorse them going to hell?