A bride-to-be asked a cakemaker to place a scripture quote on her wedding cake. “True Love Casts out Fear”. (1 John 4:18).
When it came time to make the cake, the baker went to his notes and saw JN 4:18. he looked it up, and dutifully inscribed the cake.
At the reception when the bride saw the cake, she gasped in horror and fainted.
“One” might be the loneliest number, but in this case it made all the difference.
I don’t get this.
What mistake did the cake guy make?
Compare 1-John 4:18 to John 4:18
There is a profound difference between 1 John and simply John 
Ooooh!
Now I get it!
The catholic church (later capitalized) follows apostolic tradition. It was by Jesus authority (i.e., name) that Baptism occurred.
By the way, that Matthew 28 was a later addition has been disproved. Fragments of the earliest editions in existence indicated it was present.
I disagree, so does some guy named Joseph Ratzinger, but that’s neither here nor there. Even if it is original, show me a single, solitary example from Scripture of the Apostles baptizing in such a manner. I can give you multiple instances of them baptizing in the singular name of Jesus Christ.
Only about a week transpired between what Jesus said in Matthew 28 and Peter’s sermon on Pentecost. Obviously Peter didn’t forget His command that fast, neither did Matthew, who later wrote Matt. 28:19 was present as well (Acts 1:13). We would expect him to stand up and stop Peter if he was preaching the wrong thing! ("Hey Pete, don’t you know that Jesus said . . . ") But we don’t see that. Throughout the book of Acts they routinely baptized people in Jesus’ name. And when we read the Epistles to the churches, we find that they too were baptized in Jesus’ name, not using a triune method. So its obvious that Jesus’ disciples understood the name of the Father, Son and Holy Ghost to be Jesus! NOWHERE in scripture do we find anyone being baptized using these words, only in Jesus’ name.
Yet we have instructions in two separate sources to baptize in the name of the Father, Son, and Holy Spirit.
If anyone challenged by whose authority could anyone baptize, we have the authority and words of Jesus himself.
In any case, we both know this is not about the words used to baptize. It is about Oneness versus Trinity…correct?
You’ve yet to provide a single instance from scripture where the Apostles baptized using the triune method…or baptized babies for that matter. They baptized using the name, singular, of Jesus Christ. You Catholics love tradition so much, seems like you’d want to follow that tradition as well seeing as how it’s the earliest New Testament baptismal tradition we can find. 
You folks came up with your triune baptismal terminologies in the 3rd century AD to pacify the pagans you were wanting to fold into the tribe. It was the first fatal flaw for the Catholic church, you moved away from the oldest doctrine Jehovah gave His people:
Isa 43:10 Ye are my witnesses, saith the LORD, and my servant whom I have chosen: that ye may know and believe me, and understand that I am he: before me there was no God formed, neither shall there be after me.
Isa 43:11 I, even I, am the LORD; and beside me there is no saviour. NO TRINITY OF PERSONS!
Isa 44:6 Thus saith the LORD the King of Israel, and his redeemer the LORD of hosts; I am the first, and I am the last; and beside me there is no God. NO TRINITY OF PERSONS!
Isa 44:8 Fear ye not, neither be afraid: have not I told thee from that time, and have declared it? ye are even my witnesses. Is there a God beside me? yea, there is no God; I know not any. NO TRINITY OF PERSONS!
Isa 44:24 Thus saith the LORD, thy redeemer, and he that formed thee from the womb, I am the LORD that maketh all things; that stretcheth forth the heavens alone; that spreadeth abroad the earth by myself; NO TRINITY OF PERSONS!
Isa 45:5 I am the LORD, and there is none else, there is no God beside me: I girded thee, though thou hast not known me:
Isa 45:6 That they may know from the rising of the sun, and from the west, that there is none beside me. I am the LORD, and there is none else. NO TRINITY OF PERSONS!
Isa 45:18 For thus saith the LORD that created the heavens; God himself that formed the earth and made it; he hath established it, he created it not in vain, he formed it to be inhabited: I am the LORD; and there is none else. NO TRINITY OF PERSONS!
Isa 45:21 Tell ye, and bring them near; yea, let them take counsel together: who hath declared this from ancient time? who hath told it from that time? have not I the LORD? and there is no God else beside me; a just God and a Saviour; there is none beside me. NO TRINITY OF PERSONS!
Isa 45:22 Look unto me, and be ye saved, all the ends of the earth: for I am God, and there is none else. NO TRINITY OF PERSONS!
Isa 45:23 I have sworn by myself, the word is gone out of my mouth in righteousness, and shall not return, That unto me every knee shall bow, every tongue shall swear. Jesus said also that to Him every knee shall bow and every tongue shall swear or confess… NO TRINITY OF PERSONS!
Isa 46:9 Remember the former things of old: for I am God, and there is none else; I am God, and there is none like me, NO TRINITY OF PERSONS!
Isa 48:11 For mine own sake, even for mine own sake, will I do it: for how should my name be polluted? and I will not give my glory unto another. NO TRINITY OF PERSONS!
Isa 48:12 Hearken unto me, O Jacob and Israel, my called; I am he; I am the first, I also am the last. Again, Jesus took this statement to Himself! NO TRINITY OF PERSONS!
Isa 52:6 Therefore my people shall know my name: therefore they shall know in that day that I am he that doth speak: behold, it is I. NO TRINITY OF PERSONS!
This revelation and understanding is sweeping the Christian world with great force and effect in our day! None can stop it because it is of God as He builds the latter house and pours out the latter rain… It is glorious in our eyes… Surely Jesus will come in our day!
1 Timothy 2:5-6 For there is one God, and one mediator between God and men, the man Christ Jesus; who gave himself a ransom for all…"
It was much earlier than third century…and much more complicated. Arguments can be traced back to Plato, which some opine drew some of his arguments from Moses. Basically what we have are two models. Which model best furthers our understanding of God? And of Christ. And of the Holy Spirit. It all equals the same One God.
It absolutely does not. One model is accurate, the other inaccurate and will cost you your soul. Although I am a husband, father, and son, I am not three individuals making up an entity named Rick. Likewise, I cannot sign a legal document using any title I may hold. I must sign my name for it to be valid. Baptism is a covenant, it must be done in the NAME of the greater party, there is no greater name, Neither is there salvation in any other: for there is none other name under heaven given among men, whereby we must be saved. That name is Jesus. It isnt just semantics, it is soteriological.
The reason that we are baptized in Jesus’ name is that we are being baptized into Jesus. We are taking on his name, similar to the way a woman takes on her husband’s name. We are saying that we belong to Jesus and we are identifying with Him in His death and burial. Even if God were a trinity, Jesus is the one who died for us and He is the one who the Christians at Rome were buried with .
1 Corinthians 1:13 Is Christ divided? Was Paul crucified for you? Or were you baptized in the name of Paul? If we follow Paul’s train of thought, his obvious implication is “No, Christ was the one crucified for you and so you were baptized in the name of Christ” So the believers at Corinth as well as those in Rome were baptized in Jesus’ name.
Galatians 3:27 For as many of you as were baptized into Christ have put on Christ.
Colossians 2:11 In Him you were also circumcised with the circumcision made without hands, by putting off the body of the sins of the flesh, by the circumcision of Christ, 12 buried with Him in baptism, in which you also were raised with Him through faith in the working of God, who raised Him from the dead.
In addition to those in Rome, Corinth and Ephesus (as well as Jerusalem, Judea and Samaria), we see that the Christians in Colosse and those in the region of Galatia were all baptized in Jesus’ name. They would not have connected baptism so exclusively with Christ had they routinely baptized using the words “Father, Son and Holy Spirit.” As I said before, the only way that we see anyone being baptized is in Jesus’ name.
When Jesus’ was on this earth, He baptized His disciples (John 4:1,2) and then commissioned them to go and baptize others in His name, or in His place. When Jesus baptized someone, He didn’t have to say “in Jesus name.” He was Jesus. But when we stand in his stead, we do it in his name. Scripture tells us that whatever we do in word or deed should be done in Jesus’ name (Col. 3:17). Baptism is an act of both word and deed.
What do you believe baptism does? I believe it frees us from sins, and that we are reborn as sons and daughters of God. We become members of the Body of Christ. It is our initiation into the Kingdom of God.
Do you disagree with any of this?
I was baptized in the name of the Father, the Son, and the Holy Spirit…not just a portion of it, but the whole of it.
I was about to point this out as well. How could the Catholic church move away from something that was commanded by Jesus and codified as a standard church practice before the book of Acts was probably written.
It matters to someone here with the agenda of bashing Catholicism.
Jesus’ explicit directive doesn’t matter.
I don’t think the agenda is to bash Catholicism as much as it is to present Oneness as a more accurate doctrine…one that came before Trinity.
I’m not bashing anyone. Back on topic, if that were truly Jesus’ explicit directive, why didnt the Apostles obey it rather than baptizing in the singular name of Jesus Christ?
Oneness vs Trinity aside, it doesnt change the fact that the proper baptismal formula is the Jesus’ name formula. Think of prayer…the Bible is clear that prayer is to be done “in Jesus’ name.” I doubt any Trinitarian would argue that since God is a Trinity, one should pray “in the name of the Father, Son, and Holy Spirit.” They accept Scripture that prayer is to be said in Jesus’ name, and dont see that as detracting from the Trinity. Likewise, the Jesus’ name formula poses no challenge to Trinitarian theology.
The question of how many persons are in the Godhead and the question of the proper baptismal formula are two related but separate issues. To determine the number of persons in the Godhead we examine those passages that teach us about God. To determine the proper baptismal formula we look to those passages that instruct us on baptism… When we do, it becomes apparent that the early church interpreted Jesus’ command in Matthew 28:19 to baptize in the name of the Father, Son, and Holy Spirit as a command to baptize in Jesus’ own name, as evidenced by their exclusive use of the Jesus’ name formula in the book of Acts and thereafter.
The Jesus’ name formula makes sense given the purpose of baptism as I discussed earlier: to identify us with Christ’s death, burial, and resurrection (see Romans 6:1-4).
In Trinitarian theology, the Father and Spirit didnt die, werent buried, and werent resurrected. It was only Jesus. Therefore, even on a Trinitarian view it would be entirely reasonable to be baptized only in the name of Jesus.
While I admit that baptism in Jesus’ name makes more sense from a Oneness view of God, the fact remains that both Trinitarians and Oneness believers alike can see (1) that the Jesus’ name formula is taught in Scripture, (2) that it is the authoritative apostolic interpretation of Jesus’ words in Matthew 28:19, (3) and that it makes theological sense to be baptized using the Jesus’ name formula given the purpose of baptism.
In fact, Catholics and Orthodox begin and end prayer In the name of the Father, Son, and Holy Spirit. It is true we also pray, “We ask this through Christ, our Lord.”
One is not used in favor of the other.
Two thoughts on this. First, New Testament writings don’t cover every incident and every community–only a very few. Meanwhile, Christ’s own words have an impact on many of us; the Didache confirms that for some some of us.
One thing I would like your perspective on is the incident Luke describes in Acts 8:14. There were people who had been baptized in Jesus’ name–but had not received the Holy Spirit. Apparently the apostles had to return and lay hands on them in order for them to receive the Holy Spirit.
Catholics believe our first experience with the Holy Spirit is in our baptism.
