A discussion about whiteness

Take your time.

While that sentiment is is true in part, it is indisputable that the lasting effects of State sponsored systemic racism are still being felt today.

As I mentioned before, I am currently reading " The New Jim Crow" and before anyone wants to categorize it as some sort of liberal screed, it touches on a lot of the same information and issues that are brought up in “The Rise of the Warrior Cop” which I read this past summer.

In “The New Jim Crow” there is a section about culture and how the perception of “blackness” and “black culture” works to reinforce harmful stereotypes that perpetuate different treatment based on race.

This is not to say that each and every individual will experience these things… but the statistics are pretty hard to deny.

So what I see that you posted in the OP is about perceptions of “Whiteness” or “White Culture” that are not necessarily true or special to white people ( as in that a lot of those attributes exist in all cultures) but seen as being part of being “white” those positives are assumed and are seen by some as special to white people.

I hope that that makes some sort of sense.

Define “Western Civilization”

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It does. But it’s not racial.

I don’t know I didn’t write that stupid list but it was written there as a product of whiteness under family structure.

I’m actually trying to make sense of everything, it seems new terms pop up every day and no two people use the terms the same way.

I think that a lot of problems with the conversation about all of this is that people are talking past each other.

As a white dude… been one all my life… I find it hard to get offended that my family background and the way that I look gained me advantages that those who I grew up with did not also have.

No one wants to think that they are racist ( and I think that that is a big problem with how some approach this conversation) or that they benefited from racism that they themselves do not think that they participated in ( even though actual State sponsored systemic racism was actual official policy until fairly recently… there are people who are still alive that lived with it) but it is an important issue to understand.

Not coming at it from a knee jerk reaction and trying to understand what the “other side” is trying to say… no matter how clumsily it is being said isn’t the best response.

Just my two cents.

I have several! And contemplating my whiteness is not among them. :relaxed:

Who are your top three offenders? And what did they do?

Name 5 people who are doing this and what it was they did.

Western civilization is a culture informed by Christian beliefs and Greek/Roman traditions and philosophy.

What do you think it is?

Redlining
Segregation
Jim Crow voter suppression

Not a great part of our history

A meaningless term that usually ignores all of the stuff about European history that we don’t seem to like.

I mean… Marxism is a product of Western Civilization.

You misunderstood my questions. I was looking for current problems. Sorry for not being clear.

My point is that the overt government sponsored systemic racism ended in people’s lifetimes.

It is in living memory.

Can’t just say no problems. We are all cool now because it is obvious that we aren’t.

We shouldn’t forget. But we shouldn’t wallow in it either. There is a happy medium somewhere.

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I agree about your point about Marxism. Marxism is the result of rational thought. Like scientific theories, not all prove to be correct.

Western civilization is not meaningless, but neither is it perfect.

Marxism eliminates free will. Your decisions are made for you by a select few. I wonder why it failed. :man_shrugging:

I define western civilization literally like that list is of whiteness. I mean I would add the amendments especially the 1st amendment then that list I posted on whiteness.

I am not defending Marxism, simply offering an observation on its origins.