UK Army Chief proposes first draft since 1963

[Bill.in.PA]

General Sir Patrick Sanders, who heads up the British army, called for a return to conscription which ended in 1963. He framed the call as prewar preparations for a conflict with Russia:

Speaking at a military conference, Sanders starkly described the British people as part of a “prewar generation” who may have to prepare themselves to fight in a war against an increasingly aggressive Russia. . . “We will not be immune and as the prewar generation we must similarly prepare – and that is a whole-of-nation undertaking. Ukraine brutally illustrates that regular armies start wars; citizen armies win them.”
Army chief says people of UK are ‘prewar generation’ who must be ready to fight Russia | Military | The Guardian

The UK Ministry of Defense distanced itself from the speech, but previous reports show that the British army is dire shape. Consider this report from earlier this month:

The U.K.’s arms stockpiles have been almost completely emptied by almost two years of deliveries to Ukraine, as per reports by British news outlet The Times. The British newspaper further reported that the U.K., along with other Western European nations, is rushing to increase arms production before the 2024 presidential elections in the United States.

Although London has spent more than £4.6 billion ($5.7 billion) to arm Kyiv since February 2022, NATO’s deputy supreme allied commander for Europe, General Tim Radford, cautioned in July that the U.K. could forfeit its status within the U.S.-led bloc, quoting personnel shortages, among other problems.
Times: U.K. Arms Stockpile Reduced to “Nothing” - The New American

The UK is not alone in the increased concerns about conflict with Russia. The Swedish government recently created a panicky response to warnings that the population needs to prepare for war:

MSN

Panic in Sweden after ominous warning.

Recurring mantras from the White House and the UK have been that Russia is weak and Putin has already lost. Those narratives have shifted to say that the war in Ukraine is stalemate that will go on for many years.

If military leaders really believe these narratives, then why the increasing anxiety now?

Is it just a crude attempt for more funding?

Or is it a growing recognition that the official narratives are becoming unstainable?

[thinkingman]

thats unsettling….

the world needs leaders who know how to stay out of wars and to keep them from happening

[Bill.in.PA]

Yes, the neocons who run Washington seem to have only one answer to foreign policy issues: Escalate.

[FreeAndClear]

@Bill.in.PA

Yes, the neocons who run Washington seem to have only one answer to foreign policy issues: Escalate.

Yeah well if someone would just not invade anymore to restore the Russian empire to its former glory may be they can stop.

[Impenitent]

@Bill.in.PA

Yes, the neocons who run Washington seem to have only one answer to foreign policy issues: Escalate.

When they were little, I’ll bet none of them thought “when I grow up, I want to be moving stairs”

[Bill.in.PA]

Yes, I am sure that people in Iraq, Yugoslavia, Afghanistan, Syria, etc. would agree.

[FreeAndClear]

@Bill.in.PA

Yes, I am sure that people in Iraq, Yugoslavia, Afghanistan, Syria, etc. would agree.

And Chechnya and Georgia and Kazakhstan and soon moldova

Oh and there are Russian troops in Syria and Africa.

[Bill.in.PA]

Russian troops in Syria are there with the support of the Syrian government.

The US is the invader not Russia.

[FreeAndClear]

@Bill.in.PA

Russian troops in Syria are there with the support of the Syrian government. The same true with Iraq.

The US is the invader not Russia.

It’s a civil war. “Support” is in the eye of the beholder.

There are Russian troops in Africa supporting war lords.

Your entire argument is silly

The moment Russia stops invading everybody can stop neoconning. They of course won’t but at least they can stop talking about drafts and imminent war

[bigtwnvin]

@Bill.in.PA

Yes, the neocons who run Washington seem to have only one answer to foreign policy issues: Escalate.

Here, hold my Bourbon.

[Oryx]

So one of the arguments for cutting funding to Ukraine is that Russia doesn’t really pose a threat to Europe and the rest of the world. I guess that’s false. Maybe funding Ukraine and stopping Russia there is a smart strategy after all.

[Bill.in.PA]

The recent panic in Sweden is especially ironic. For over 200 years, Sweden has avoided foreign invasion with a policy of neutrality. Now it joins NATO, and there is panic about a Russian invasion.

In WW2, Sweden avoided a German invasion by allowing German troops to transit through the country to Finland and Norway, supplying critical war materials, and allowing thousands of Swedes to fight with Finland against the Soviet Union. After it became clear the Soviets were going to win, Sweden ended these policies and tilted strongly towards the allies.

How long will it take for Sweden to abandon NATO now that it has nearly joined?

Hungary is the last holdout for Sweden's NATO membership. So when will Orbán...

[Oryx]

@Bill.in.PA

For over 200 years, Sweden has avoided foreign invasion with a policy of neutrality. Now it joins NATO, and there is panic about a Russian invasion.

You have the timeline backward. Sweden was worried about a Russian invasion, so they joined NATO.

[bigtwnvin]

The Russkies will be content having military equipment destroyed and sending their young and old men through the meat grinder in Ukraine it’s of no consequence Ukraine is not a formal member of NATO. And even if the Ukes are admitted to the club, Vlad the inbred Slav will continue because the European members won’t want to ■■■■ with that aggressor who has nukes at their disposal and crazy enough to use them.
The Ukrainian young male population is dwindling. Eventually someone will have to stare down Ivan’s AK-47 or say no mas.

[Bill.in.PA]

Yes, if Cuba wants to be really secure from a US invasion it needs to get some Chinese and Russian military bases on the island. How well did that work for it in 1962?

[Oryx]

@Bill.in.PA

Yes, if Cuba wants to be really secure from a US invasion it needs to get some Chinese and Russian military bases on the island. How well did that work for it in 1962?

What does Cuba have to do with Sweden and Europe? This thread went off the rails faster than usual. . .

[Oryx]

@bigtwnvin

The Russkies will be content having military equipment destroyed and sending their young and old men through the meat grinder in Ukraine it’s of no consequence Ukraine is not a formal member of NATO. And even if the Ukes are admitted to the club, Vlad the inbred Slav will continue because the European members won’t want to ■■■■ with that aggressor who has nukes at their disposal and crazy enough to use them.
The Ukrainian young male population is dwindling. Eventually someone will have to stare down Ivan’s AK-47 or say no mas.

It’s up to Ukrainians how long they want to fight and die to protect their homeland, not NATO or Russia.

[FreeAndClear]

@Bill.in.PA

Yes, if Cuba wants to be really secure from a US invasion it needs to get some Chinese and Russian military bases on the island. How well did that work for it in 1962?

You have a point there except for one issue. Russia actually invaded another country. Once that is taken into consideration then it kind of all falls apart.

Russia is not going to invade Sweden but a Russian attack to reconnect Kaliningrad to Russia could involve the russian navy fleet offly close to Sweden.

[Bill.in.PA]

Thank you for illustrating how failure to see things from an opponent’s perspective can provoke needless wars.

If US nukes on Russia’s doorstep are fine, then Russian nukes on the US doorstep should be fine as well.

Sweden accepts 'essential role of nuclear weapons' in Nato letter

Finland may allow NATO to place nuclear weapons on border With Russia

[Oryx]

@Bill.in.PA

Thank you for illustrating how failure to see things from an opponent’s perspective can provoke needless wars.

If US nukes on Russia’s doorstep are fine, then Russian nukes on the US doorstep should be fine as well.

Europe is full of nukes. Nukes are already on Russia’s doorstep and have been for generations. Modern technology makes location pointless anyway. We can nuke anyone in the world without positioning silos on their border. And did I miss NATO proposing to put nukes into Ukraine as a Russian deterrent, or is this just another Putin fever dream?