Does NEWSMAX have an agenda? If so, what is it?

NEWSMAX’s go-to guy for legal pontificating seems to be former Judge Andrew Napolitano. If NEWSMAX has employed Andrew Napolitano as a talking head to reflect NEWSMAX’S mission, it would be safe to assume that mission is certainly not to support and defend the text of our federal constitution, and its documented legislative intent, which gives context to its text.

For example Napolitano goes to great lengths to assert the Fourteenth Amendment guarantees that a child born to an illegal entrant while on American soil becomes a citizen of the United States upon birth.

But those who defend the text of the Fourteenth Amendment, and its documented legislative intent, which gives context to its text, and with respect to the qualifying words “and subject to the jurisdiction thereof”, understand Napolitano is blowing smoke and ignoring a fundamental rule when determining what our Constitution means.

That rule was stated in crystal clear language by our Supreme Court a number of times, e.g., ”The whole aim of construction, as applied to a provision of the Constitution, is to discover the meaning, to ascertain and give effect to the intent of its framers and the people who adopted it.”_____HOME BLDG. & LOAN ASSOCIATION v. BLAISDELL, 290 U.S. 398 (1934)

One of the few times the Supreme Court did approached answering this question was in the Slaughterhouse Cases 83 U.S. 36, 73 (1873) . The Court wrote “[t]he phrase, ‘subject to its jurisdiction’ was intended to exclude from its operation children of … citizens or subjects of foreign States born within the United States .”

A couple years later, in in Minor v. Happersett 88 U.S. 162, 167-68 (1875), all the Court’s members expressed “doubts” that citizenship was granted, by the terms of our constitution, to “children born within the jurisdiction without reference to the citizenship of their parents,” and the Court did so after expressly pointing out that citizenship attaches only when the immigrant owes “allegiance” to this country.

So, why would our Supreme Court make the above comments which are contrary to Napolitano’s assertion?

The answer is to be found in the Congressional Globe, 39th Congress, which framed and debated the 14th Amendment, and it provides the documented intentions and beliefs under which the Fourteenth Amendment was adopted. For example, in discussing the proposed 14th Amendment, Senator Howard explains the clear intentions of the 14th Amendment as follows:

The first amendment is to section one, declaring that all "persons born in the United States and Subject to the jurisdiction thereof, are citizens of the United States and of the States wherein they reside. I do not propose to say anything on that subject except that the question of citizenship has been fully discussed in this body as not to need any further elucidation, in my opinion. This amendment which I have offered is simply declaratory of what I regard as the law of the land already, that every person born within the limits of the United States, and subject to their jurisdiction, is by virtue of natural law and national law a citizen of the United States. This will not, of course, include persons born in the United States who are foreigners, aliens, who belong to the families of ambassadors or foreign ministers accredited to the Government of the United States, but will include every other class of persons. It settles the great question of citizenship and removes all doubt as to what persons are or are not citizens of the United States. This has long been a great desideratum in the jurisprudence and legislation of this country. see: Congressional Globe, 39th Congress (1866) pg. 2890

Later, and after the question was repeatedly asked as to who is and who is not a citizen of the United States, Mr. TRUMBULL responds as follows SEE: page 2893, Congressional Globe, 39th Congress (1866), 1st column halfway down

“The provision is, that “all persons born in the United States, and subject to the jurisdiction thereof, are citizens.” That means “subject to the complete jurisdiction thereof.” . . . “What do we mean by “subject to the jurisdiction of the United States?” Not owing allegiance to anybody else. That is what it means.”

Mr. Trumbull later emphasizes in crystal clear language that: “It cannot be said of any Indian who owes allegiance, partial allegiance if you please, to some other Government that he is “subject to the jurisdiction of the United States”

Mr. JOHNSON then rises to say: “…there is no definition in the Constitution as it now stands as to citizenship. Who is a citizen of the United States is an open question….there is no definition as to how citizenship can exist in the United States except through the medium of a citizenship in a State.

“Now, all that this amendment provides is, that all persons born in the United States and not subject to some foreign Power–for that, no doubt, is the meaning of the committee who have brought the matter before us–shall be considered as citizens of the United States.” …he then continues “…the amendment says that citizenship may depend upon birth, and I know of no better way to give rise to citizenship than the fact of birth within the territory of the United States, born of parents who at the time were subject to the authority of the United States.”

And then there is John A. Bingham, chief architect of the 14th Amendments first section who considered the proposed national law on citizenship as “simply declaratory of what is written in the Constitution, that every human being born within the jurisdiction of the United States of parents not owing allegiance to any foreign sovereignty is, in the language of your Constitution itself, a natural born citizen…” Cong. Globe, page 1291(March 9, 1866) middle column half way down.

And so, a baby born to a foreign national mother while on American soil is not subject to the jurisdiction of the United States within the meaning of the 14th Amendment, nor becomes a citizen of the United States upon birth.

So why is Andrew Napolitano, the go-to guy at NEWMAX for its legal pontificating, when Napolitano ignores the most fundamental rule of constitutional construction, stated as follows?

”But there is another question underlying this and all other rules for the interpretation of statutes, and that is what was the intention of the legislative body? Without going back to the famous case of the drawing of blood in the streets of Bologna, the books are full of authorities to the effect that the intention of the lawmaking power will prevail even against the letter of the statute; or, as tersely expressed by Mr. Justice Swayne in 90 U.S. 380 :

“A thing may be within the letter of a statute and not within its meaning, and within its meaning, though not within its letter. The intention of the lawmaker is the law.” Hawaii v. Mankichi, 190 U.S. 197

Napolitano seems to be an advocate of the Humpty Dumpty theory of language when interpreting what our constitution means:

“When I use a word,” Humpty Dumpty said, in rather a scornful tone, “it means just what I choose it to mean- neither more nor less.”

“The question is,” said Alice, “whether you can make words mean so many different things.”

“The question is,” said Humpty Dumpty, “which is to be master-that’s all.”

JWK

Those who reject abiding by the text of our Constitution, and the intentions and beliefs under which it was agree to, as documented from historical records ___ its framing and ratification debates which give context to its text ___ wish to remove the anchor and rudder of our constitutional system so they may then be free to “interpret” the Constitution to mean whatever they wish it to mean.

Napo has always been a liberaltarian.

Think newsmax wants to make money by getting clicks.

2 Likes

Napolitano is an idiot…a pretender. I remember him decades ago. He stumbled onto a niche to make a living out of.

2 Likes

If you’re here illegally and give birth, the child should be illegal too and it isn’t even questionable. Committing a crime does not then give you a legal benefit for that crime. Congress should have addressed this long ago but “we” have problems on both sides of our corrupt aisles.

1 Like

Maybe. But that’s not what the constitution says.

Isn’t that most talking heads?

1 Like

Uh oh please let’s not go down this rabbit hole again. Mid noughties Thousands and thousands of posts on this very topic and it ended up with two posters going back and forth relentlessly echoing the same point again and again and again :grinning::grinning::grinning::grinning:

1 Like

If you want to change the Constitution, there is a process for that. Pass an amendment. Otherwise, that kid is an American.

7 Likes

I am curious as to why the idea that birthright citizenship… which has been established for over a century… should not be a thing?

What motivates this?

2 Likes

My daughter who lives in England is pregnant and I told her jokingly to come visit in August when she is due so baby can be a US citizen. Then she sent me reams of data on illustrating the really poor maternity outcomes in the US. Note to self no more jokes to my pregnant daughter.

The good news is that it will be grandchild #4 :grinning:

6 Likes

Our Supreme Court has been explicitly clear with regard to this issue.

Here is what our Supreme Court stated in “Slaughter-House Cases”

“The phrase, “subject to its jurisdiction” was intended to exclude from its operation children of ministers, consuls, and citizens or subjects of foreign States born within the United States.” Slaughter-House Cases, 83 U.S. 36, 73 (1872)

A couple years later, in in Minor v. Happersett 88 U.S. 162, 167-68 (1875), all the Court’s members expressed “doubts” that citizenship was granted, by the terms of our constitution, to “children born within the jurisdiction without reference to the citizenship of their parents,” and the Court did so after expressly pointing out that citizenship attaches only when the immigrant owes “allegiance” to this country. And this is one reason why we have a National Oath of Allegience to the United States . . . so, children born to naturalized citizens, become citizens upon birth.

And let us not forget what our Supreme Court stated in Elk v. Wilkins, 112 U.S. 94, 101-2 (1884) regarding the Fourteenth Amendment:

“This section contemplates two sources of citizenship, and two sources only: birth and naturalization. The persons declared to be citizens are “all persons born or naturalized in the United States, and subject to the jurisdiction thereof.” The evident meaning of these last words is, not merely subject in some respect or degree to the jurisdiction of the United States, but completely subject to their political jurisdiction, and owing them direct and immediate allegiance. And the words relate to the time of birth in the one case, as they do to the time of naturalization in the other. Persons not thus subject to the jurisdiction of the United States at the time of birth cannot become so afterwards, except by being naturalized, either individually, as by proceedings under the naturalization acts, or collectively, as by the force of a treaty by which foreign territory is acquired.”

The bottom line is, Andrew Napolitano makes up crap about our Constitution, and has repeatedly ignored that part of the 14th Amendment which has the qualifying words “…and subject to the jurisdiction thereof”.

The preponderance of the evidence confirms, Andrew Napolitano simply makes up ■■■■ to advance his anarchist libertarian views. And he pontificated the same crap regarding States being required to embrace homosexual marriages.

JWK


The whole aim of construction, as applied to a provision of the Constitution, is to discover the meaning, to ascertain and give effect to the intent of its framers and the people who adopted it.
_____HOME BLDG. & LOAN ASSOCIATION v. BLAISDELL, 290 U.S. 398 (1934)

But the reality is that children born here are citizens (yes I know that does not extend to foreign diplomats).

You can cite the constitution and previous SC cases as much as you want but it does not change the fact that in the real world these children are US citizens. No one can deny them their right to live here, vote and enjoy all the rights of citizenship as much as any other citizen.

The reality is, our Constitution’s is being trashed and ignored. And you seem to support that trashing.

Congrats!

2 Likes

In your opinion its being trashed. I get that you do not recognize them as citizens but the reality is they are. Nothing is going to change that short of a constitutional amendment to make it crystal clear.

You posting walls of text on an online forum does nothing to change the reality of what is happening which is they can work, live, vote, serve on a jury etc just like aby other citizen.

Though no one can deny you provide context, cite exames etc to support your opinions.

2 Likes

Ahhhhhhhh…so now you want the Constitution enforced or is it the lib eenie, meenie, mynie moe methodology that actually applies?

Here’s the Constituion that applies; Section 4
The United States shall guarantee to every State in this Union a Republican Form of Government, and shall protect each of them against Invasion;

Now here they are here invading our country that the traitorous President you voted for…encouraged. I’ll wait for your intelligent response and thanks in advance. :sunglasses: :tumbler_glass:

1 Like

Oh dear - I hope you’re not supporting Trump’s candidacy for president. After all, he has openly talked about terminating parts of the constitution.

Oh but that’s ok because it’s Donald, if he’s for it the sheepole are for it too.

1 Like

Why would I engage with someone who is so condescending to me?

My so-called opinion is in harmony with what our Supreme Court has stated, and I documented HERE

Here is what our Supreme Court stated in “Slaughter-House Cases”

“The phrase, “subject to its jurisdiction” was intended to exclude from its operation children of ministers, consuls, and citizens or subjects of foreign States born within the United States.” Slaughter-House Cases, 83 U.S. 36, 73 (1872)

A couple years later, in in Minor v. Happersett 88 U.S. 162, 167-68 (1875), all the Court’s members expressed “doubts” that citizenship was granted, by the terms of our constitution, to “children born within the jurisdiction without reference to the citizenship of their parents,” and the Court did so after expressly pointing out that citizenship attaches only when the immigrant owes “allegiance” to this country. And this is one reason why we have a National Oath of Allegience to the United States . . . so, children born to naturalized citizens, become citizens upon birth.

And let us not forget what our Supreme Court stated in Elk v. Wilkins, 112 U.S. 94, 101-2 (1884) regarding the Fourteenth Amendment:

“This section contemplates two sources of citizenship, and two sources only: birth and naturalization. The persons declared to be citizens are “all persons born or naturalized in the United States, and subject to the jurisdiction thereof.” The evident meaning of these last words is, not merely subject in some respect or degree to the jurisdiction of the United States, but completely subject to their political jurisdiction, and owing them direct and immediate allegiance. And the words relate to the time of birth in the one case, as they do to the time of naturalization in the other. Persons not thus subject to the jurisdiction of the United States at the time of birth cannot become so afterwards, except by being naturalized, either individually, as by proceedings under the naturalization acts, or collectively, as by the force of a treaty by which foreign territory is acquired.”

The bottom line is, Andrew Napolitano makes up crap about our Constitution, and has repeatedly ignored that part of the 14th Amendment which has the qualifying words “…and subject to the jurisdiction thereof”.

The preponderance of the evidence confirms, Andrew Napolitano simply makes up ■■■■ to advance his anarchist libertarian views. And he pontificated the same crap regarding States being required to embrace homosexual marriages.

The question is, why is Napolitano the go-to guy for NEWSMAX on constitutional issues when he makes up ■■■■■ ?

JWK

Those who reject abiding by the text of our Constitution, and the intentions and beliefs under which it was agree to, as documented from historical records ___ its framing and ratification debates which give context to its text ___ wish to remove the anchor and rudder of our constitutional system so they may then be free to “interpret” the Constitution to mean whatever they wish it to mean.