Will the real oppressors please stand up

very.

They were in some respects.

In others, not so much.

The real world isnā€™t as cut and dried.

What is true however, is that the call to preserve ā€œSouthern Heritageā€ and to explain away the symbols of the Confederacy as anything other than symbols of slavery and racism, comes by and large form those that declare themselves to be conservatives.

And that Southern Democrats in the war/postwar period were mostly conservative (Abraham Lincoln, for crying out loud, was as big a ā€œbig government libā€ that could have existed back then).

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Likewise for anyone who would judge modern southerners for what their predecessors did.

Nice to know you think Washington, Jefferson et al were trash.

I asked no question, I posited a theory in answer to a theoretical question. If you donā€™t like it, tough ā– ā– ā– ā– ā–  So no, you did not give any question the response it deserved because you did not respond to any question. You knee jerked a childish response. Why am I not surprised? Does the thought of ending slavery without 1/2 million dead bother you?

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What dodge? You said Southern democrats, you didnā€™t specify a time period. Wasnā€™t much different between post CW southern democrats and pre 1964 southern democrats.

I was responding to a person who specified a time frameā€¦so why would you assume I was talking about any other time frame than what the poster specified?

Posts donā€™t happen in a vacuum.

ahhhā€¦ my bad. I see it now

Read Lincolnā€™s words again. Yes, the sentiments were there on both sides. A big reason the South seceded was because of the economic stranglehold the North had put on it.

Not according to their own writings.

In their own writings it was because they wanted to preserve slavery.

Yes they sometimes translated that into economic terms (mostly around property rights- the property of course being slaves).

But slavery is by far the biggest reason they seceded.

But the Noble Lost Cause Fairy Tale spun by the United Daughters of the Confederacy has deep rootsā€¦

Mostly slavery though. Letā€™s ask literally any of the people that founded the CSA. Letā€™s read their constitution.

Probably a huge coincidence that all this Lost Cause bull ā– ā– ā– ā–  fell out of style for decades, right up until civil rights became a big thing. Then it got super popular again. Wonder why.

There was absolutely no way they could have avoided war.

Both sides had been wanting a final showdown since the ink dried on the constitution, of which neither side got what they wanted out of.

Essentially the instant the South lost its outsized influence (it could control Congress by getting just a few Northern Congresspeople on its sideā€¦that was all but gone by 1860), they wanted out.

They had the same representation in Congress as any other state.

In the senate yes. Representation was always equal.

Not in the house for most of the early 19th century, though. They were over represented due to the 3/5ths clause. States that banned slavery only counted their white and black populations. Southern states got to count all of that plus 3/5s of their enslaved population.

you are really confused. The 3/5 compromise did not count slaves once and then again as 3/5. It counted them only as 3/5. Blacks in the north were counted whole, because they were not slaves. The south wanted to count them whole, the north did not want to count them at all. Neither here nor there however, VA was the most populous state.

They shouldnā€™t have been counted at all. Legally speaking they werenā€™t ā€œpeople.ā€ They were property.

The northern statesā€™ position was the correct one. If the southern states got to count their enslaved property then the north should have got to count their dogs and cats.

Because that is exactly what slaves were. They were property. Not people in any legal sense of the word.

The south got far more power in the house than they were ever entitled to. And their interests dominated the federal government until the 1850s.

please stand upā€¦ and I was looking for slim shady

no argument there

You donā€™t even see the contradiction in your reasoning here do you? You guys are so conditioned to spout the lefts narrative that you donā€™t even think about what you are saying.

Lincoln was a Republican that hated slavery. Johnson was a southern Democrat that hated slavery. Read the post you responded to. If the Republicans that began getting elected in the south caused resentment. Iā€™m assuming you believe they had to be Lincoln Republicans, then who were the Democrats that had regained power by the late 1870s? Presumably they were pro slavery Democrats right? Yet by your statement southern Democrats were conservatives that hated slavery like Andrew Johnsonā€¦ See what Iā€™m getting at here? Please, how about a little consistency in which party stands for what.

Sure there wasā€¦