When are "red lines" important? Australia says possible Chinese base is a "red line"

Democrats bitterly complained about Trump flattering tyrants. Biden has adopted the spit-on-the-table and yell-insults approach. How is that working out?

“Red Lines” have lost their meaning.

Exactamundo. One can’t just base their Russia/Ukraine assessment on “who invaded who”. That’s Kamala Harris level of thinking.

Yes, and it overlooks that war in eastern Ukraine started in 2014 has never stopped since then. Western media ignored the war; Russian media did not.

History did not start in February 2022.

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That’s cool as hell. Chances are likely that he met guys like John Basilone and Robert Leckie.

Every Marine on that island was brave as hell. They weren’t provisioned well at all and had to fight the Japanese with no land artillery or even naval artillery for the first few weeks of the operation. They were using old WWI stockpiles for their machine guns and rifles.

It had to have been a horrific battle to be in.

So Russia should have trusted their security on some rule in a NATO plan? Seriously? I can see Putin telling his generals after Ukraine became a member “But NATO PROOOMISED”.

At the June 2021 Brussels summit, NATO leaders reiterated the decision taken at the 2008 Bucharest summit that Ukraine would become a member of the Alliance with the MAP as an integral part of the process and Ukraine’s right to determine its future and foreign policy, of course without outside interference.[11] NATO Secretary General Jens Stoltenberg also stressed that Russia will not be able to veto Ukraine’s accession to NATO “as we will not return to the era of spheres of interest, when large countries decide what smaller ones should do.”[12]

It is reasonable when thinking about this to consider the national motivation and character of the nations involved.

Ukraine was concerned about its defense, (and rightly so) and sought to join a defensive organization. In addition, we have noted repeatedly that Ukraine was not in a position to enter NATO anytime soon.

By contrast, China is currently in an expansionist mood, and a naval base in the Solomons is an extension of the radically expansionist 9-Dash line.

Therefore, it is appropriate to regard these two different assertions of a red line differently. But as ever, in geopolitical relations, might makes right. Australia may view this as a red line, but I doubt that Biden will.

Our Politicians gave China all this power by allowing them in the WTO. Short sighted fools, and greed.

not some rule in a NATO plan, the NATO charter. No nation can join NATO if they have unresolved border disputes. It is an ironclad element of the charter itself. It cannot be changed unless all nations in NATO agree to change the charter. That ain’t happening. Russia had complete control of it as long as they occupied Crimea.

LOL, Biden probably sold China the new improved red line.

There was an honest belief that bringing China in from the cold would have a democratizing effect. And to be fair, it is Xi who has changed China’s trajectory. Prior to his ascension, China was reasonably content to be an economic powerhouse.

So I wouldn’t say “fools”, I’d say “naive”. But also greedy. We wanted that enormous market opened.

Derp.

What’s he going to do about it?

Seriously now… I don’t expect to change your mind but if you look at Russian history in the 20th century, you will see that they have some experience with agreements, ironclad elements, treaties, whatever. You know the saying “fool me once shame on you; fool me twice shame on me” ? I’m sure there must be a Russian translation. They were not going to be fooled twice. They were not going to put their trust in any “ironclad element” of any foreign document. It is just fact.

Yes, that is good question. He claims the US supports the red line.

Posturing and negotiations appear to be the first step.

Australia has sent troop to the Soloman Islands before. Troops could go there again.

I assume that the US Navy could intercept ships or planes coming from China if negotiations fail.

My Uncle didn’t talk about that time, even to his 4 brothers who also served. My Uncle Jack was on the DD. The Uncle on Guadalcanal was the youngest of the 5 who served. My Dad was the middle brother (Army Air Corps}. The older 2 brothers were Army Infantry in Europe. My Dad and Uncle Jack also served in the Korean War.

whats just a fact is that it was a convenient excuse for building the russian empire anew.

An alleged Chinese spy base in Cuba is a “provocation”.

US spy planes over eastern Ukraine next to the Russian border are not a provocation. See the difference?

US biolabs in Ukraine… “no problemo” says faithful Biden/Zelensky spokespersons.

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I am sure that the US would have no problem with Russian and Chinese biolabs in Tijuana, just like enforcement of drug laws and kidnapping laws in Mexico is strictly up to the Mexican government.