61

That is horse ■■■■■

Vehicles are better engineered and safer. Still not near zero.

62

Your confusion on the 2 arguments is they represent 2 different groups of assailants. The criminal murder group is using an alternative weapon against an “unarmed” victim. In the tyrannical government scenario, the government will have firearms. Gun control advocates don’t seek disarmament of the ruling government, only the disarmament of the subjugated private citizens.

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63

I dunno.

Gun violence/mass shootings are not a new phenomena and certainly one that precedes helicopter parenting/participation trophy trend that’s fairly new.

And just one example - both Dylan Klebold and Eric Harris (Columbine shooters) come from stable two-parent homes.

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64

True, however if you’re going to hold both views, it’s akin to tacit admission that guns are unique when compared against other would-be weapons in their effectiveness. i.e. it’s easier to kill and injure with guns (especially with precision) than other objects.

65

You are trying to circle back to a disarmament argument. Man still uses every individual weapon he has ever created. The issue with weapons isn’t what they are used for, but rather why they are being used. They brings us back to the individual human, not the specific instrument he elected to wield that day.

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66

Hmm, no, not really - unless they are a hobbyist or an indigenous tribe of some sort, you don’t see too widespread of a bow and arrow or spear usage.

Guns are uniquely effective in doing what they do, otherwise they likely would not have even been invented in the first place.

67

Trying to move the goal posts now are we. Hand, feet, rock, club, spear, bow (long and cross), hammer, axe, hatchet, black powder, modern cartridge, flame, chariot (vehicle). They are all still used, and it is still about the purpose of the user, not the instrument. But feel free to keep chasing that tail which is always just out of reach.

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68

I’m not moving any goal posts at all.

Today guns are a preferred tool of those who wish to kill and injure over, say, crossbow and arrows in the same way cars are a preferred tool of those who wish to travel from point A to point B over, say, horse and carriage.

Disagree ?

69

You are shifting the focus because your attempt to declare a mutually excluding situation crashed into a mountain. You are just trying to rationalize a path back to a starting point for your disarmament argument. As I said, chase that tail, wonder in the wilderness.

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70

How am I shifting focus ? Focus is the same as it’s been - either guns are not uniquely effective in their deadliness in which case they are easily replaced by other weapons or they are, in which case they are necessary for one to defend themselves against either criminals or a tyrannical government.

But both of these statement cannot be true simultaneously.

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71

Can’t help you with your reasoning.

72

Correct, I suspect you cannot :wink:

73

Such a well researched post, backing up your claim with detailed evidence. How can I not but agree?

74

You need to read your link again.

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75

And a ban on “assault weapons” and hi-cap mags.

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76

AR-15-style then. Geez, so much nitpicking :grimacing:

77

Read it again. They are talking about the ammunition, not the weapon. Which is of course stupid.

And he might have bought it legally, the minute he entered the village limits he was in violation.

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78

The link that I posted talks about the rifles that were purchased.

79

Officials have said the weapon used in it was a high-powered rifle but have not specified what type.

Covelli said Tuesday that it dispersed “high-velocity rounds similar to an AR-15”

Rounds is ammo, not rifle.

Your link.

80

Cool. But the OP didn’t ask for ask for speculation on truck deaths, did it?

Having said that, I am surprised that we haven’t seen more of these mass killings with semis. Either in crowds, or on the road.