WAR in Ukraine, Putin approves initiation of special military operation (Part 1)

Samm · 2022-07-18T03:33:31.416Z

Bill.in.PA:

The story about the TikToker prosecution came from Ukrainian news sources.

Are they spewing Russian propaganda as well?

Good for them. I was not talking about Tik Tokers.

Bill.in.PA · 2022-07-18T10:51:02.942Z

News reports implied that the shopping mall was a civilian target. A video shows that Ukrainian army was using the mall for military purposes, and the government announced the arrest the man who posted the video.

Western reporting has been very misleading.

Bill.in.PA · 2022-07-18T12:57:26.418Z

It looks like the manure is about to the hit the rotating air-moving device. Who saw that coming?

ZeroHedge

Gazprom Declares Force Majeure, Will Halt Gas Flows To Germany Indefinitely

Reuters cites source saying letter to "European customer" in question is Germany...

Bill.in.PA · 2022-07-18T13:12:04.626Z

Ukraine cannot possibly keep up with the loss of trained soldiers.

https://twitter.com/Ukraine66251776/status/1546098319486746625

Samm · 2022-07-18T21:02:36.289Z

Bill.in.PA:

News reports implied that the shopping mall was a civilian target. A video shows that Ukrainian army was using the mall for military purposes, and the government announced the arrest the man who posted the video.

Western reporting has been very misleading.

All reporting is misleading, not just the west’s. The truth is always obscured in war.

But I didn’t mention shopping malls.

Happyhappyjoyjoy · 2022-07-20T19:21:07.838Z

the Guardian – 20 Jul 22

Russia may seek to occupy more territory in Ukraine, says foreign minister

Sergei Lavrov’s televised remarks give signal Kremlin is planning a campaign to annex more regions

But this is all about NATO, honest…

Bill.in.PA · 2022-07-20T19:30:49.087Z

Yes, NATO has broken multiple agreements with Russia. Is it even possible to reach a peace agreement given so many broken promises?

Even the New York Times is starting to allow the truth to seep into discussions about the war in Ukraine:

twitter.com

Glenn Greenwald

@ggreenwald

As the article notes, "Karaganov warned for years about a potential conflict in Ukraine over NATO expansion." His primary claim is the US/NATO have been heavily active in Ukraine for years, and deliberately converted Russia back into an enemy of the West to serve elite interests. https://t.co/QY0evNl0Zc

3:50 PM - 20 Jul 2022 400 82

nytimes.com – 19 Jul 22

Opinion | Why Russia Believes It Cannot Lose the War in Ukraine

An interview with Sergey Karaganov.

Happyhappyjoyjoy · 2022-07-20T19:48:10.231Z

In happier news…

Putin was humiliated by Erdogan

the Guardian – 20 Jul 22

Erdoğan keeps Putin waiting in awkward moment ahead of Tehran talks

Russian president was left standing alone as the camera shutters clicked away – a treatment he usually reserves for other world leaders

And managed to shoot down one of his own shiny new planes

Forbes

The Russians Just Shot Down One Of Their Own Best Jets

Russian air-defense troops just shot down one of the most sophisticated warplanes involved in Russia’s wider war in Ukraine. But it was a Russian warplane.

Oh dear…

FreeAndClear · 2022-07-20T19:52:59.099Z

I wonder why Greenwald didn’t post this as a screen cap

Wait actually no no i don’t.

image1170×2532 207 KB

Bill.in.PA · 2022-07-20T21:43:00.125Z

Actually the excerpt makes at least three points that have been largely ignored in western media reports:

NATO expansion has been a known red line going back 25 years,
Russia sees that the rise of ultra-nationalists in Ukraine resembles that in Germany in the 1930s, and
Donbass has been subjected to 8 years of bombardment.

FreeAndClear · 2022-07-20T21:50:22.379Z

Bill.in.PA:

Actually the excerpt makes at least three points that have been largely ignored in western media reports:

NATO expansion has been a known red line going back 25 years,

Russia sees that the rise of ultra-nationalists in Ukraine resembles that in Germany in the 1930s, and

Donbass has been subjected to 8 years of bombardment.

So why then has he continuously compared himself to Peter.

If he takes eastern and southern Ukraine how does that prevent them from joining nato once peace is established

This nonsense doesn’t pass the smell test.

However on the laugh test scale. This is really high up

Oryx · 2022-07-20T21:50:37.278Z

At least Western media reports are still free to report the news.

TechCrunch – 19 Jul 22

Russia hits Google with a $375M fine for allowing 'prohibited' Ukraine news...

Russia fined Google 21.1 billion rubles ($374 million) on Monday for repeatedly failing to “remove prohibited information” — content related to the country’s invasion and subsequent war in Ukraine. The country’s telecommunication watchdog...

Est. reading time: 2 minutes

FreeAndClear · 2022-07-20T21:51:37.026Z

15 years for saying anything bad about the operation but yeah these are people throwing out free information

Greenwald can ….

Bill.in.PA · 2022-07-20T22:26:21.381Z

The UK recently required that search engines remove any results that the government views as “Russian disinformation”, which has come to mean anything that disagrees with the official narratives from the western intel community.

PublicTechnology.net – 7 Jul 22

New laws to require websites to ‘proactively seek and remove’ Russian...

Credit: Rawpixel Updated laws will require social networks and search engines to “proactively look for and remove disinformation” disseminated by the Russian state and other hostile nations. Government announced this week that the National Security...

POLITICO

Hunter Biden story is Russian disinfo, dozens of former intel officials say

More than 50 former intelligence officials signed a letter casting doubt on the provenance of a New York Post story on the former vice president's son.

Europe and Russia are in race to see who can destroy free speech with greater zeal.

Orygun · 2022-07-20T23:05:51.498Z

FreeAndClear:

I wonder why Greenwald didn’t post this as a screen cap

Wait actually no no i don’t.

Putin sure showed NATO- which is now expanding to include Finland and Sweden.

By the way 18 GOP reps voted against allowing this. (Usual suspects). I wonder how many no votes in the senate…

https://www.marketwatch.com/story/sweden-and-finland-want-to-join-nato-but-these-18-republicans-voted-no-11658251617

Bill.in.PA · 2022-07-20T23:42:16.749Z

It is irrelevant if Turkey does not get what it wants out of Sweden and Finland. That includes extraditing Kurds to face trial in Turkey.

the Guardian – 30 Jun 22

Erdoğan warns Turkey could still block Finland and Sweden’s accession to Nato

Turkish president stressed the countries must meet Ankara’s demand to extradite terror suspects

If Finland eventually joins, then every nation that took part in the 1941 invasion of Russia will be a member of NATO. What could go wrong?

https://indianexpress.com/article/explained/finland-air-force-swastika-symbol-6490140/

e7alr · 2022-07-21T01:08:32.477Z

Interesting assessment of Russian losses today by former CIA directer Burns. He estimated Russian KIA at 15,000. That is about half the estimate that has been coming out of the Ukrainian PAO releases. This doesn’t speak to wounded, but it is a lot lower than has been circulating. I would like to see what he is basing this on.

e7alr · 2022-07-22T02:05:46.173Z

It is very, very quiet right now in the news coming out of Ukraine. The maps aren’t being updated and not a lot of front line images. There is a lot of talk about a Ukrainian counter offensive in the works, but you don’t talk about such things and then expect them to actually work.

Ben_Natuf · 2022-07-22T11:52:08.812Z

depends on where they go.

JayJay · 2022-07-22T12:49:28.906Z

conan:

JayJay:

Once again you were essentially telling everybody to accept your take on the matter because anything else is “mere propaganda”.

Everything is…just like I recognize many things that you libs ridiculed me for over hte years only to be true.

On one hand you libs tell me Russia wants Ukraine resources…but at the same breath you trying to convince me that Europe doesn’t want Ukraine resources? You either have to be totally naive or complete ■■■■■■■ stupid…so which is it Jay?

This is a red herring.

You still aren’t defending your positions…you’re ridiculing everyone else’s,

You refuse to even consider that the real situation is more nuanced than “EU Bad”, and so you lash out at others when they dare to have a different opinion.

Just more elaborate fortifications so you can continue to believe what you want to believe without ever testing the assumptions that undergird those beliefs.