This is what indoctrination looks like

[WuWei]

@Janet_Miller

Unfortunately in my neck of the woods a lot of parents don’t teach that.

Many children were entering Massachusetts kindergartens with pretty advanced decay, so any in pre-K programs for at least four hours a day had to have toothbrushing while in school at least offered to a parent, who, if the approved, supplied the brush & paste.

That’s an interesting story. Why do you suppose that is necessary?

[Samm]

@amadeus

@Samm

If you say so champ.

OK, duderotimous.Curious. Have you had your daily duderectormy? Judy kidding, young grasshopper.

Who is the grasshopper? Certainly not me kid.

[Samm]

@Borgia_dude

@Samm

@Borgia_dude

@Samm

No, but you cannot give it carte blanche either. As an engineer, I have seen far too many instances where statistics were used to justify terrible decisions by people who did not know what they were doing.

Sure. But as an engineer one cannot just dismiss a study that has statistics without a rationale. Just saying, “Statistics can lie” is a lazy dismissal.

Why? It’s the truth. Relying on statistics without knowing exactly what they represent or how they were developed is a fools game.

Specifically, do you know how the statistics regarding covid cases vs. masks were developed? Do you know what other factors were included or excluded in arriving at the conclusion those statistics suggest?

You could just read the study. It seems pretty straightforward but if you have specific concerns please air them. Just discussing unnamed possibilities isn’t science.

The study did not account for variables. They only looked at masks and infections.

[Borgia_dude]

@Samm

@Borgia_dude

@Samm

@Borgia_dude

@Samm

No, but you cannot give it carte blanche either. As an engineer, I have seen far too many instances where statistics were used to justify terrible decisions by people who did not know what they were doing.

Sure. But as an engineer one cannot just dismiss a study that has statistics without a rationale. Just saying, “Statistics can lie” is a lazy dismissal.

Why? It’s the truth. Relying on statistics without knowing exactly what they represent or how they were developed is a fools game.

Specifically, do you know how the statistics regarding covid cases vs. masks were developed? Do you know what other factors were included or excluded in arriving at the conclusion those statistics suggest?

You could just read the study. It seems pretty straightforward but if you have specific concerns please air them. Just discussing unnamed possibilities isn’t science.

The study did not account for variables. They only looked at masks and infections.

You seem to be conflating statistical studies with lab experiments.

[Samm]

Not at all. The two are not at all the same. In this particular case, the “study” did not look at any variables other than were masks being worn and how many Covid cases occurred. The did not look at any other variable that might have affected the number of cases, but rather drew a straight line correlation (statistically) between the two points.

[WuWei]

Which one is better?

[Borgia_dude]

@Samm

Not at all. The two are not at all the same.

Yes, that’s my point. Statistical studies don’t control for all variables so you shouldn’t expect them to.

In this particular case, the “study” did not look at any variables other than were masks being worn and how many Covid cases occurred. The did not look at any other variable that might have affected the number of cases, but rather drew a straight line correlation (statistically) between the two points.

Share what you think might effect the results so dramatically.

[Borgia_dude]

@WuWei

Which one is better?

It isn’t a question of better. Lab experiments are better at isolating variables but not as good at creating real world conditions.

[ResPrivita]

@Orygun

There is no objective truth!

There is only Truth…

Brevard County, Florida, Covid August 30, 2021

[tnt]

@Samm

No, but it also cannot be ignored. Being right is in this case is nothing more than a matter if opinion.

No, it’s not.

And for some reason, bright, thoughtful people insist on ignoring that plain fact.

[Konssurvative1]

As I said I wasn’t commenting on the conversation. It seems to me you want to make my comment about something it’s not…because you don’t want to address the comment.

Fair enough. I’ll just move on.

[Konssurvative1]

I’m hardly an urban dweller. I grew up In a town of about 12000 people. Hardly urban. We learned this stuff at home too…but we learned about why at school. We learned to brush our teeth at home. We learned about tooth decay, gingivitis and the like at school

[ResPrivita]

@Konssurvative1

Hardly urban.

Well, I guess I wouldn’t buy that for a dollar from you then young man!

[Oldandtired]

City folk you were.

[Samm]

@Borgia_dude

@Samm

Not at all. The two are not at all the same.

Yes, that’s my point. Statistical studies don’t control for all variables so you shouldn’t expect them to.

In this particular case, the “study” did not look at any variables other than were masks being worn and how many Covid cases occurred. The did not look at any other variable that might have affected the number of cases, but rather drew a straight line correlation (statistically) between the two points.

Share what you think might effect the results so dramatically.

Off the top of my head, public events, travel to other places, visitors from other places, significant exposure within peer groups prior to mask requirements, vaccination rates, … there must be scores of reasons why Covid cases could be higher in some schools other than lack of masks.

[Samm]

@tnt

@Samm

No, but it also cannot be ignored. Being right is in this case is nothing more than a matter if opinion.

No, it’s not.

And for some reason, bright, thoughtful people insist on ignoring that plain fact.

Like you for instance?

[Samm]

@Konssurvative1

As I said I wasn’t commenting on the conversation. It seems to me you want to make my comment about something it’s not…because you don’t want to address the comment.

Fair enough. I’ll just move on.

The key to your confusion is in your own words: “it seems to me … “

[Borgia_dude]

@Samm

@Borgia_dude

@Samm

Not at all. The two are not at all the same.

Yes, that’s my point. Statistical studies don’t control for all variables so you shouldn’t expect them to.

In this particular case, the “study” did not look at any variables other than were masks being worn and how many Covid cases occurred. The did not look at any other variable that might have affected the number of cases, but rather drew a straight line correlation (statistically) between the two points.

Share what you think might effect the results so dramatically.

Off the top of my head, public events, travel to other places, visitors from other places, significant exposure within peer groups prior to mask requirements, vaccination rates, … there must be scores of reasons why Covid cases could be higher in some schools other than lack of masks.

The only one there that is substantive is vaccine rates which they did account for. The rest are taken care of by sample size. They didn’t compare one school to one school where some of those events you listed might have an outsized effect. Their sample was 999 schools.

No, you don’t like the results so don’t accept the study and justify yourself via throwing the kitchen sink of complaints at it. You haven’t shown a single complaint of yours to actually apply yet you’ll discredit the study regardless.

[Janet_Miller]

CPS? That’s government, no?

Is dying laughing against our terms of service? I don’t think so.

CPS is notorious for taking children from families with minor problems & placing them in foster care, some of whose temporary placements are far worse.

Those children who actually need their protection don’t get it. It’s next to impossible to sever the parenting rights of even the most unfit. He was killed years ago, but look up Bradley Gene McGee as an example.

I’d rather see the kids get health class than any of these extreme examples. When I lived closer to the city, people make a number of excuses, including not having dental insurance, to just let their kids’ teeth rot.

Since they wouldn’t teach them hygiene at home, I’d
rather schools/preschools/day cares use some of the time the kids are there to help them out in those areas.

[WuWei]

@Borgia_dude

@WuWei

Which one is better?

It isn’t a question of better. Lab experiments are better at isolating variables but not as good at creating real world conditions.

Statistics create real world conditions?