The US the Greatest Country on Earth?

toreyj01 · 2021-12-16T15:09:04.979Z

Samm:

toreyj01:

So the short answer is, when it comes to the question is the US the greatest country on earth?

It could be, it should be, but it isn’t.

That begs the question … which country is? (… and why do you think so?)

No country is perfect, but I still prefer a strong Capitalist society with enough Socialist programs to even out the hard times.

In that regard, I actually think Germany is doing things pretty well.

These are the advantages of living in Germany over the US…

Habeus Corpus - They don’t have the Patriot Act there, and you cannot be held on suspicion of being a terrorist for prolonged periods of time. They also ensure that citizens have the right to be forgotten, with the government resistant to invading the privacy of its citizens. So, no NSA level snooping.
Lots of guns, but only in the right hands. You need to be certified and registered to have firearms, but you can have them. You need to secure them and they check periodically that you are being responsible. Criminals and the mentally ill are barred from firearms licenses.
Respect for the Police. You don’t see Police busting down doors in the middle of the night, stealing money from citizens because it “might” be drug money, or shooting citizens. When a police officer approaches someone in Germany they don’t fear for their lives.
Lack of barriers to a better life. Low to no cost college, but you have to serve your country in some capacity for a year. This teaches civic duties to young people who need to learn it.
Multi-Cultural society. They take in immigrants without a fuss, and the immigrants are treated better than in France or the UK. They take in a million people a year and get them to work, pronto.
Nationalized health care. Their system has private and public plans. Germany has long had the most restriction-free and consumer-oriented healthcare system in Europe. Patients are allowed to seek almost any type of care they wish whenever they want it. And they have a surplus. The effect of health costs on the GDP are less than 11%. It is 18% here despite not having Universal Health care.
Voting. Every German citizen over 18 can vote, and there is no nonsense like the electoral college there. Every vote is equal.
Freedom from the nanny state. Prostitution is legal, you can have a beer at 16 years of age, all religions are taught in school, marijuana is set to be legalized nationwide next year. And there is no “woke” culture. You can even smoke in bars there, for most of the country.

So, yeah, Germany has its problems like any other country, but you don’t have to worry about crime, jobs are plentiful, healthcare is free, college is cheap, folks aren’t spied on and they have tremendous abilities to travel and even hold dual citizenship, and they have embraced multiculturalism. So I would probably place them tops, but only because it is so similar to the US, just done a lot better.

Guilds · 2021-12-16T15:14:24.590Z

toreyj01:

So, yeah, Germany has its problems like any other country, but you don’t have to worry about crime, jobs are plentiful, healthcare is free, college is cheap, folks are spied on and have tremendous abilities to travel and even hold dual citizenship, and they have embraced multiculturalism. So I would probably place them tops, but only because it is so similar to the US, just done a lot better.

Let’s also remember, this is “conservative”, in Germany.

Striker840 · 2021-12-16T15:14:29.871Z

amadeus:

Eagle-Keeper:

NJBob:

amadeus:

Every man and woman for themselves.
[/quote]

I find that a sad way to live. But I guess that’s just me.

I’ve got mine because I’m awesome. Screw you.

How much of your own personal wealth have you given to the poor around you? How much of their own personal wealth have liberal politicians given to the poor?

First of all, I don’t have a lot of personal wealth. I’m a school teacher. But I live in a mostly black neighborhood. My wife and I took the kid across the street from a broken home home into our fold. We were his support family and gave him more of our income than we could afford. But it turned out for the best.

That’s awesome, my dad and step-mom fostered then adopted 4 special needs kids, Danny who had mental issues, was white, and eventually made a life for himself.

Treyvonne who was a crack baby who also had severe psychological issues. He ended up going to a new home better able to handle him, last I talked to him he was in JuCo trying to earn a degree.

Larissa, also a drug baby, was on the spectrum and was non functioning, could not talk, no impulse control, sweet, sweet girl. Sadly we lost her January 21, 2016.

Finally Kevonna, another drug baby, brought her home from the hospital. We were told she would never walk or talk. Well, she won’t shut up but is dependent on her chair. She has cerebral palsy, since my dad and step mom are both gone, she stays with her aunt.

The last 3 are black, all 3 had major health issues, my family is white, my dad’s side sadly has quite a bit of history with the Klan. My dad broke that cycle, and was “gasp” conservative. He taught me to look at the person, not their skin color, to look at the person, not if they have an “innie” or “outie”.
Every other person other than some family I know look at it the same way.

My point is simple, political views does NOT make one racist, or any other “ist” that the left loves to use to group all conservatives in.

I am not posting this to brag, in fact I am posting this to show that any “ism” or “ist” is NOT based on political but personal views.

As far as Sneaky’s question, I take it as he is asking if you ever put on a uniform, ever risked your life while in uniform for someone you don’t know, or was a representative of the Government.

WuWei · 2021-12-16T15:17:53.674Z

A lot of that is not accurate. #5 for example.

WuWei · 2021-12-16T15:18:59.201Z

Why are you still here?

toreyj01 · 2021-12-16T15:23:56.112Z

WuWei:

A lot of that is not accurate. #5 for example.

Over a quarter of Germans weren’t born in Germany. If you live there for 8 years, have a job and pass the citizenship test, you can be a German. They are the most aggressive European country and probably country in general to accept refugees. This includes Kurds displaced in Turkey, Syrians from their civil war, etc.

WuWei · 2021-12-16T15:27:48.939Z

toreyj01:

WuWei:

A lot of that is not accurate. #5 for example.

Over a quarter of Germans weren’t born in Germany. If you live there for 8 years, have a job and pass the citizenship test, you can be a German. They are the most aggressive European country and probably country in general to accept refugees. This includes Kurds displaced in Turkey, Syrians from their civil war, etc.

They have immigration protest riots. It’s been a couple of years, but they have them.

How many of their immigrants are illegals?

WuWei · 2021-12-16T15:28:26.021Z

toreyj01:

Over a quarter of Germans weren’t born in Germany.

That’s a month here.

toreyj01 · 2021-12-16T15:29:48.242Z

WuWei:

toreyj01:

Over a quarter of Germans weren’t born in Germany.

That’s a month here.

In the US about 14% of our population are immigrants.

WuWei · 2021-12-16T15:30:57.740Z

toreyj01:

WuWei:

toreyj01:

Over a quarter of Germans weren’t born in Germany.

That’s a month here.

In the US about 14% of our population are immigrants.

1/4 M a month. Illegals.

toreyj01 · 2021-12-16T15:34:03.909Z

WuWei:

toreyj01:

WuWei:

A lot of that is not accurate. #5 for example.

Over a quarter of Germans weren’t born in Germany. If you live there for 8 years, have a job and pass the citizenship test, you can be a German. They are the most aggressive European country and probably country in general to accept refugees. This includes Kurds displaced in Turkey, Syrians from their civil war, etc.

They have immigration protest riots. It’s been a couple of years, but they have them.

How many of their immigrants are illegals?

Their policies are so welcoming there isn’t a need, worker visas are easy to obtain because they have lower birth rates and a huge need for labor. There are roughly 1 million undocumented people in Germany out of a population of 90 million people, so roughly a quarter of our population. That would infer an undocumented population of 4 million for the US if all things were equal, when it fact we have roughly 40 million people who are undocumented, ten times the rate.

WuWei · 2021-12-16T15:34:54.984Z

Then stop trying to compare them.

toreyj01 · 2021-12-16T15:40:01.908Z

WuWei:

Then stop trying to compare them.

Samm asked me what country I thought did it better, and I not only said which, I also said with some detail why, as he requested. Whether or not you agree is moot, this is my opinion and it is based on some solid evidence. Your results and opinions may vary.

Germany is very similar to the US in sentiment and approach to things, they are a modern capitalist society, hard working and civic minded. They are Conservative by nature and very family oriented. To me, they are a model for what we should aspire to, while still keeping our identity and values, because we share a lot of them.

FlameHeart · 2021-12-16T15:42:01.175Z

Germany has a robust economy. They are part of the backbone of the EU. And it’s true; they will work until they drop.

WuWei · 2021-12-16T17:10:09.413Z

toreyj01:

WuWei:

Then stop trying to compare them.

Samm asked me what country I thought did it better, and I not only said which, I also said with some detail why, as he requested. Whether or not you agree is moot, this is my opinion and it is based on some solid evidence. Your results and opinions may vary.

Germany is very similar to the US in sentiment and approach to things, they are a modern capitalist society, hard working and civic minded. They are Conservative by nature and very family oriented. To me, they are a model for what we should aspire to, while still keeping our identity and values, because we share a lot of them.

Fair enough. I completely disagree and will leave you with this: that grass on the other side? It just looks greener.

toreyj01 · 2021-12-16T20:03:09.031Z

WuWei:

toreyj01:

WuWei:

Then stop trying to compare them.

Samm asked me what country I thought did it better, and I not only said which, I also said with some detail why, as he requested. Whether or not you agree is moot, this is my opinion and it is based on some solid evidence. Your results and opinions may vary.

Germany is very similar to the US in sentiment and approach to things, they are a modern capitalist society, hard working and civic minded. They are Conservative by nature and very family oriented. To me, they are a model for what we should aspire to, while still keeping our identity and values, because we share a lot of them.

Fair enough. I completely disagree and will leave you with this: that grass on the other side? It just looks greener.

Understood, to me, Germany is a good example because we both have had pretty bad histories. Here, we try to whitewash it while protecting statues of people who fought to preserve slavery and destroy the union. We try and limit the teaching of our history by labeling it as “CRT”, taking books from Black authors and historians off the shelves, like Toni Morrison.

Germany has a recent terrible history, with their involvement in WWII (I know I can’t say their political movement’s name). But you don’t see statues of their political or military leaders from then anywhere. Any promotion of that ideology is forbidden, and their approach now is to erase that era from their public identity and embrace hard work and multiculturalism. There is a lot we can learn from that, you don’t have to deny what happened and you can move on.

TheRedComet · 2021-12-16T21:52:03.529Z

The issue with the way Germany handles Nazism is that their constitutional right to freedom of speech doesn’t match ours. The Basic Law states that there is freedom of speech, but in another article it expands on the details by forbidding political speech that glorifies either the Nazi regime or other movements considered to be a threat to human rights.

That interpretation isn’t really compatible with the first amendment in the United States. As long your speech isn’t directing political violence as it occurs, you’re free to speak out freely on any subject for any cause. After all, we have both Nazi groups and communist organizations in the United States.

Neo-Confederates can march freely here. Neo-Nazis cannot march freely in Germany. The US Constitution and the German Basic Law are completely different documents with two different ideas on what constitutes free speech.

Mainly because both documents are framed from two different sources. The constitution is based on political, social, and economic liberty. The Basic Law is at its core focused on the protection of human rights.

Samm · 2021-12-16T23:55:33.874Z

Guilds:

Samm:

Really? You’re the one who brought Smollett into this.

No, I did not.

Yes you did. Quote:

Guilds:

Call_me_Ishmael:

Maybe you never read or heard MLK Jr’s dream speech.

It appears, that is the only speech you know from MLK.

Didn’t Smollett get convicted? How many Dems defended him after the truth came out?

Samm · 2021-12-17T00:04:03.445Z

toreyj01:

Samm:

toreyj01:

So the short answer is, when it comes to the question is the US the greatest country on earth?

It could be, it should be, but it isn’t.

That begs the question … which country is? (… and why do you think so?)

No country is perfect, but I still prefer a strong Capitalist society with enough Socialist programs to even out the hard times.

In that regard, I actually think Germany is doing things pretty well.

These are the advantages of living in Germany over the US…

Habeus Corpus - They don’t have the Patriot Act there, and you cannot be held on suspicion of being a terrorist for prolonged periods of time. They also ensure that citizens have the right to be forgotten, with the government resistant to invading the privacy of its citizens. So, no NSA level snooping.

Lots of guns, but only in the right hands. You need to be certified and registered to have firearms, but you can have them. You need to secure them and they check periodically that you are being responsible. Criminals and the mentally ill are barred from firearms licenses.

Respect for the Police. You don’t see Police busting down doors in the middle of the night, stealing money from citizens because it “might” be drug money, or shooting citizens. When a police officer approaches someone in Germany they don’t fear for their lives.

Lack of barriers to a better life. Low to no cost college, but you have to serve your country in some capacity for a year. This teaches civic duties to young people who need to learn it.

Multi-Cultural society. They take in immigrants without a fuss, and the immigrants are treated better than in France or the UK. They take in a million people a year and get them to work, pronto.

Nationalized health care. Their system has private and public plans. Germany has long had the most restriction-free and consumer-oriented healthcare system in Europe. Patients are allowed to seek almost any type of care they wish whenever they want it. And they have a surplus. The effect of health costs on the GDP are less than 11%. It is 18% here despite not having Universal Health care.

Voting. Every German citizen over 18 can vote, and there is no nonsense like the electoral college there. Every vote is equal.

Freedom from the nanny state. Prostitution is legal, you can have a beer at 16 years of age, all religions are taught in school, marijuana is set to be legalized nationwide next year. And there is no “woke” culture. You can even smoke in bars there, for most of the country.

So, yeah, Germany has its problems like any other country, but you don’t have to worry about crime, jobs are plentiful, healthcare is free, college is cheap, folks aren’t spied on and they have tremendous abilities to travel and even hold dual citizenship, and they have embraced multiculturalism. So I would probably place them tops, but only because it is so similar to the US, just done a lot better.

That’s a very fine speech about how great you think Germany is for Germans, but it does not spell out why you think Germany deserves the accolade of “greatness” among all other countries. What have they done lately on the world stage to move them above and beyond where the US was or even still is in terms of greatness on the historic global scale?

Samm · 2021-12-17T00:09:04.529Z

toreyj01:

WuWei:

Then stop trying to compare them.

Samm asked me what country I thought did it better, and I not only said which, I also said with some detail why, as he requested. Whether or not you agree is moot, this is my opinion and it is based on some solid evidence. Your results and opinions may vary.

Germany is very similar to the US in sentiment and approach to things, they are a modern capitalist society, hard working and civic minded. They are Conservative by nature and very family oriented. To me, they are a model for what we should aspire to, while still keeping our identity and values, because we share a lot of them.

Actually, I didn’t ask you that. I asked what county was greater. There is a significant difference.