Texas school district says 4 year old must cut hair or wear dress

party-free · 2019-09-18T17:36:39.095Z

So did you read this part:

party-free:

Completely and utterly sexual discrimination. If a female can wear a pony tail, or a bun, etc., why can’t a male? Or, why must a boy, who identifies as a boy, be forced to wear a dress to school in order to have long hair?

I directly made the point that I don’t believe it is racial, but I do believe it is sexual.

Janet_Miller · 2019-09-18T17:51:59.240Z

Life and work are full of different standards for boys and girls. School too.

It wasn’t so reasonable where I went to high school, for example, for young women to be allowed to wear miniskirts in hot weather, but no shorts for the young men.

It’s about the age many will be trying for their first volunteer & job opportunities, and many interviewers won’t be open to shorts & miniskirts. Maybe it’s time for trousers & longer skirts.

Now maybe it’s not so reasonable to impose these codes as young as 4 years old, but it’s their district and therefore their decision as to what minimum standards are.

party-free · 2019-09-18T20:27:10.597Z

Janet_Miller:

Life and work are full of different standards for boys and girls. School too.

Why? Standards of behavior should be exactly the same. Why not standards of dress?

I’m in my 12th year of teaching. I’m a tall, male with long hair nearly worn in a ponytail, 3 ear piercings, and my professionalism has never been called into question. I was hired because I was the most qualified candidate. And I teach in a VERY rural, religious part of the country.

Janet_Miller:

It wasn’t so reasonable where I went to high school, for example, for young women to be allowed to wear miniskirts in hot weather, but no shorts for the young men.

It’s about the age many will be trying for their first volunteer & job opportunities, and many interviewers won’t be open to shorts & miniskirts. Maybe it’s time for trousers & longer skirts.

Now maybe it’s not so reasonable to impose these codes as young as 4 years old, but it’s their district and therefore their decision as to what minimum standards are.

They CAN decide, but that doesn’t mean it’s not discriminatory.

Why can a girl wear her hair in a bun or ponytail, but this boy could not?

Guvnah · 2019-09-18T20:57:46.751Z

Seems to me the school has chosen a strange hill to waste its resources on.

But if this is a matter of discrimination, it’s not about race. It’s about hairstyles. ( shrug )

party-free · 2019-09-18T21:28:58.057Z

I don’t disagree there.

As I mentioned in my OP, I actually find this to be a problem of sexual discrimination.

Why can’t a guy wear a pony tail or a bun, or a “puff” but a girl can?

I think that’s pretty absurd.

My school system just majorly overhauled our dress code-we wasted SO much time worrying about stupid stuff like “does your shirt have a collar? Are the bottoms of your jeans frayed? (no joke) Does your shirt have a brand logo on it? (no joke).”

If a guy wants to wear his hair long, so what? What “standard” does that violate? If a female wants to have a short cut, is that allowed?

party-free · 2019-09-18T21:30:25.909Z

Janet_Miller:

Life and work are full of different standards for boys and girls.

Should we compel young women to have long hair cuts? Beehives maybe? Buns? Is that a problem that violates “different standards” or can we objectively look at old-fashioned sexual standards like this and realize they serve no purpose other than trying to force our own beliefs about appearance on others?

mccoyfan · 2019-09-18T22:15:53.635Z

The district can tell the child to cut the hair unless its an expression of speech but can not tell to wear a dress as alternative option.

Guvnah · 2019-09-18T23:56:49.677Z

This might be a harbinger of that might happen if the school (and the kid’s parents) stick to their guns:

https://www.msn.com/en-us/sports/more-sports/wrestlers-dreadlocks-controversy-resolved-ref-suspended-two-years/ar-AAHuoTT?li=BBnb7Kz

Guvnah · 2019-09-18T23:57:35.978Z

party-free:

Why can’t a guy wear a pony tail or a bun, or a “puff” but a girl can?

Cultural standards.

Different parts of the country have differing standards.

Excast · 2019-09-18T23:58:39.629Z

Screw the “cultural standards” of Texas. A kid’s hair length should be the last thing a school is worried about.

Ex-Pat · 2019-09-19T00:04:19.201Z

If his parents want him to look like a girl, he should be allowed to look like a girl.

mccoyfan · 2019-09-19T02:37:28.637Z

At least they didn’t tell him to dress up like Betsy Ross

DougBH · 2019-09-19T04:47:11.437Z

I don’t know of any federal civil rights statute that prevents separate dress codes by gender. There may be some states that have such codes, but Texas isn’t one of them.

Basically, discussion about what one does or doesn’t think is an appropriate dress code makes sense but that is just local standards.

What my kids elementary school says about hair:

“Unusual hair styles, hair color, make up, or jewelry that might interfere with learning is discouraged.”

Vague as heck. And “discouraged” isn’t exactly the same as “prohibited”.

CanadianJudo · 2019-09-19T04:55:18.343Z

I’m cool with dress-codes but what is up with the if you have long hair you need to wear a dress that is over the top sexist, and a little homophobic.

CanadianJudo · 2019-09-19T04:57:36.419Z

The only federal rule on dress code is they can’t be discriminatory based on sex, race, religion.

so for example you can’t refuse to let a boy wear a dress because he is a boy.
you need to find another reason.

DougBH · 2019-09-19T04:59:00.276Z

CanadianJudo:

The only federal rule on dress code is they can’t be discriminatory based on sex, race, religion.

so for example you can’t refuse to let a boy wear a dress because he is a boy.
you need to find another reason.

Can you cite that Federal law, rule or regulation? We’re not talking Canada here.

CanadianJudo · 2019-09-19T05:04:31.238Z

Title 3 of the civil right act there has been a number of cases,

woman fired for wearing a Hijab (She sued and won)

POLITICO

Supreme Court rules against Abercrombie in hijab case

The clothing chain declined to hire Samantha Elauf in 2008 as a sales associate.

now hair is a messy subject, currently before the Suprme is a case about a woman who wasn’t hired because she had dreadlock.

Vox – 18 Apr 18

A black woman lost a job offer because she wouldn’t cut her dreadlocks. Now...

Chastity Jones’s lawyers argue that racial stereotypes can be evidence of job discrimination.

There is also a case about a woman who was fired for being transgender and refusing to wear gendered clothing.

Michigan Radio – 10 Sep 19

U.S. Supreme Court will decide Michigan transgender woman’s employment...

Aimee Stephens took months to compose a letter to her employer in July 2013. It read: “With the support of my loving wife, I have decided to become the…

Title 3 prohibit discrimination based on Sex, Race, Religion
American disability act prohibit discrimination based on a registered disability.

those are the only federal laws that apply but its a case by case application.

DougBH · 2019-09-19T13:18:20.676Z

CanadianJudo:

.

Well, I have to admit you did well to go to the right place.
I have my doubts, though, that you will find a case where it says you can’t have gender specific clothes, such as no dresses for boys but allowed for girls.

merickson · 2019-09-19T14:22:27.792Z

Oryx:

Schools have a right and a responsibility to make sure students aren’t distracting other students. But in this case, I don’t see how a boy with long hair is distracting kids from learning their ABCs. The school district is out of bounds.

There is the active “shoot rubber bands at kids” kind of distracting. And then there’s the passive “look more interesting than the teacher’s lesson” kind of distracting.

Schools seem to be too interested in the second kind. Particularly in regards to female students and students with a different hair type than the school board.

mccoyfan · 2019-09-19T21:26:43.750Z

Perhaps U.S. Supreme Court case Tinker vs. Des Moines Independent School District

… schools may limit student expression (such as dress codes) if such expression will be disruptive to the learning environment or violate the rights of others.