Something seems so wrong here

[LouC]

From what little I was able to glean she had also suffered from anorexia nervosa.
It is just so sad. The fact she did not yell out about the earliest abuse is a condemnation upon society. No one should ever have abuse that they hide because of embarrassment.

[Samm]

@adroit

@Samm

It is all explained in the OP link. The Government of Holland has endorsed such activity by sanctioning in in law.

Hmm. Does the US government endorse racist speech? Does it endorse marital infidelity? Does it endorse Islam or Christianity?

After all, engaging in those things are “sanctioned” by law. Does a government endorse all activity it does not ban?

Technically, yes … they do.

[Blackwolf]

Clearly not, and in that scenario the Dutch government would not have approved or assisted in the suicide.

Do you think they just rubber stamp every request in this capacity, or maybe they make a determination after looking into each case?

[MidwestIndy]

@conan

I understand some things can’t be fixed. But I can’t help but to wonder if we are relying to much on medication and so-called professionals.

Sometimes the best solution are the easiest ones. We sometime over complicate things that become detrimental to our own health.

I say this with respect Conan, despite what I know is DEEP differences in opinion. Some things simply can’t be fixed no matter what one does. No medicine, no therapy whether professional or alternative. Some times people just don’t want to exist on this Earth. As much as you or I might want to understand it or think we could offer up a different solution, it just doesn’t exist sometimes.

I don’t know about you, but I really don’t want ANYONE else determining how I choose to either continue or end my life period! There was a time where I was very much anti marijuana and so on. At some point I became congnizant that it wasn’t up to me to make excuses or tell others how to live or die. The only exceptions I make to this is where a person’s decision puts the lives of a living, breathing human on this earth aka post birth in jeopardy directly.

That means if you drink and drive, and you kill someone … ■■■■ you. If you drive impaired under the influence of drugs and harm someone … ■■■■ you.

If you kill yourself and someone who says they love you decide to kill themselves … well that was a choice they made on their own, not something that you physically did to them, in other words they still themselves had a choice in the matter.

[MidwestIndy]

@Samm

@adroit

@Samm

It is all explained in the OP link. The Government of Holland has endorsed such activity by sanctioning in in law.

Hmm. Does the US government endorse racist speech? Does it endorse marital infidelity? Does it endorse Islam or Christianity?

After all, engaging in those things are “sanctioned” by law. Does a government endorse all activity it does not ban?

Technically, yes … they do.

Do you believe that a person has no right to choose when they die? And if you do are you really ok with that?

Thats not a strawman those are real questions.

[conan]

This isn’t about whether one has a right to off him or herself. If that what adult wants to do knock yourself out. This is about doctor assistant suicide of a 17 year old…who has been tormented since age 11 and again at 14.

We talk about intervention prior to mass murders. Why didn’t someone intervene here?

Something is seriously wrong with this logic.

[Samm]

@MidwestIndy

@Samm

@adroit

@Samm

It is all explained in the OP link. The Government of Holland has endorsed such activity by sanctioning in in law.

Hmm. Does the US government endorse racist speech? Does it endorse marital infidelity? Does it endorse Islam or Christianity?

After all, engaging in those things are “sanctioned” by law. Does a government endorse all activity it does not ban?

Technically, yes … they do.

Do you believe that a person has no right to choose when they die? And if you do are you really ok with that?

Thats not a strawman those are real questions.

I have already made myself clear on that, but I will repeat it for you. A person near the end of their natural life (regardless of their age) particularly one who is suffering in pain (I completely buy into the premise “we would never let our beloved pets suffer like that when there is no expectation of recovery …”) has a right to end their suffering. But a person who does not meet that criteria has no right to inflict the immense pain, guilt and sorrow onto their friends and loved ones who are left behind. While I find the criminalization of suicide illogical, I believe Government has a responsibility to strongly discourage suicide, and not sanction it as Holland has done.

[SimplyTrying]

@highroller

The government doesn’t need to punish people for attempting suicide, but they should never be endorsing it because life is difficult. We all go through tragedies, some more than others.

The only argument I could see is that there is a terminal illness that you will never recover from and causes extreme pain, but only in that limited capacity.

I completely agree. And I speak from personal experience. What looks dark and hopeless now could turn into a happy productive life.

I know there is great suffering for some and that they cannot see any happy world beyond their darkness. Not now. That’s where friends are needed, and love is needed. I pray for those who want to end their lives that they can hold on until there is a break in the clouds.

[adroit]

@Samm

Technically, yes … they do.

That’s bs and you know it. Permission does not equate to support and approval.

[MidwestIndy]

@conan

This isn’t about whether one has a right to off him or herself. If that what adult wants to do knock yourself out. This is about doctor assistant suicide of a 17 year old…who has been tormented since age 11 and again at 14.

We talk about intervention prior to mass murders. Why didn’t someone intervene here?

Something is seriously wrong with this logic.

Who says people didn’t? In fact its pretty obvious many people did. She suffered from this for years. Wrote a book about her suffering, had thousands of social media followers where she posted quite frequently about the struggles.

After more research it turns out the OP was factually incorrect. The government of the Netherlands did not euthanize this girl. She starved herself to death and the government and her parents simply agreed not to intervene this final time. This was after she had already tried unsucessfully to end her life in previous attempts including at least once where she was put into a coma and force fed nutrients.

Make no mistake, intervention attempts were made. She was set on ending her life and that is and should be her choice.

[MidwestIndy]

@Samm

But a person who does not meet that criteria has no right to inflict the immense pain, guilt and sorrow onto their friends and loved ones who are left behind.

Friends, loved ones have no right to not suffer from the immense pain, guilt, and sorrow. It isn’t their choice one way or the other.

[Forcefield]

@Axxowiz

At 17? Your not even allowed to legally vote till your 18 and drink till 21, but assisted suicide when the brain hasn’t fully developed at 17?

The fox article is misleading. The government did not assist her suicide, she died at home. Her country does not have any kind of support system for mentally ill / traumatized children.

Girl, 17, who was sexually abused at 11 is legally allowed to die

[JayJay]

This has been an interesting discussion, but as it turns out?

The story in the OP that started this discussion actually isn’t true. She asked for euthanasia…and was refused.

https://twitter.com/NaomiOhReally/status/1136189899672084480

[Forcefield]

@MidwestIndy

After more research it turns out the OP was factually incorrect. The government of the Netherlands did not euthanize this girl. She starved herself to death and the government and her parents simply agreed not to intervene this final time. This was after she had already tried unsucessfully to end her life in previous attempts including at least once where she was put into a coma and force fed nutrients.

I am shocked - SHOCKED that Fox News deliberately implied this was some twisted Government death panel killing a teenager. Well, not that shocked.

[JayJay]

@Forcefield

@MidwestIndy

After more research it turns out the OP was factually incorrect. The government of the Netherlands did not euthanize this girl. She starved herself to death and the government and her parents simply agreed not to intervene this final time. This was after she had already tried unsucessfully to end her life in previous attempts including at least once where she was put into a coma and force fed nutrients.

I am shocked - SHOCKED that Fox News deliberately implied this was some twisted Government death panel killing a teenager. Well, not that shocked.

Well now the debate will shift to “Why didn’t the government or her parents intervene while she was starving herself to death?”

[Forcefield]

Jinx!

[MidwestIndy]

@JayJay

Well now the debate will shift to “Why didn’t the government or her parents intervene while she was starving herself to death?”

Maybe they should have hopped her up on the best anti-depressants they could find and chained her to a bed the rest of her natural life. Then we’d all have a feel good story about how we saved a life, or maybe they could have bought her a pony that would certainly have done it.

[Forcefield]

@JayJay

Well now the debate will shift to “Why didn’t the government or her parents intervene while she was starving herself to death?”

It’s another case of the CEC latching onto a private anecdotal situation and capitalizing on it to fuel the outrage machine. Terri Schiavo all over again. It’s none of our business.

[JayJay]

@Samm

But a person who does not meet that criteria has no right to inflict the immense pain, guilt and sorrow onto their friends and loved ones who are left behind.

People actually have a right to do whatever they wish to do- whether it causes immense pain to others or not (barring outright attacking others physically and/or mentally, that is).

It might be selfish…we can debate its morality…that doesn’t mean people don’t have the right to do it.

People make choices all the time…not limited to killing themselves…that cause immense pain to their loved ones…some of them aren’t even “bad”…it’s just right for them.

[MidwestIndy]

@Forcefield

It’s another case of the CEC latching onto a private anecdotal situation and capitalizing on it to fuel the outrage machine. Terri Schiavo all over again. It’s none of our business.

To be fair it wasn’t just Fox News that did this, but their story vetting hasn’t always been that great either.