Russian Jet downs American drone over international waters in the Black Sea

Bottom line, what Russia did is a direct and definitive act of war; how we react to it is up to us. I will withhold judgement until I see the entire scope of our reaction. IMHO we should:

  1. Openly admit it was an act of war, but downplay the severity and increase surveilance in the black sea. announce no other measure “in connection” to it. Neither confirm nor deny any other decision is connected to it in anyway.

  2. Quietly provide aid to Ukraine in the form of the DPICM artillery ammunition we have so far withheld that they requested.

  3. Announce “NATO preparedness” measures including the replacement of any aircraft on reasonable terms to NATO partners who provide Ukraine with soviet era jets.

  4. Quietly let allies know that if they have older NATO jets they wish to replace we will be open to working out favorable terms taking into account the value of the older jets.

  5. Quietly allow Ukraine ATACMS and older decommissioning cruise missiles.

  6. Announce our reaffirmation that the right of self defense for any country includes the right to destroy military targets and staging points used to attack them no matter where they are (This is already international law).

  7. Quietly provide Ukraine with more timely intelligence as to the location of Russian commanders in the field (you know we know where they are). We were doing this, we seem to have stopped because we got nervous about dead Russian Generals.

The cost should be high, but it should not be some loud chest thumping brandonite theater.

  1. Mind our own business.
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Russian aggression is our business

Towards the US, sure. The Ukraine is not one of the several states.

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Brandon will screw it up.

Russian aggressions were Hillary’s business with the debunked dossier.

My heart goes out for the innocent people caught in the middle of the cross fire of this proxy

you are entitled to any opinion you want to hold. So am I.

there is no proxy

Russia invaded Ukraine
Ukraine is fighting for itself, not for us
we provide Ukraine aid in THEIR struggle

i have little doubt of that.

“Don’t underestimate Joe’s ability to ■■■■ things up.”–President Obama

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Mine is based on logic. Not fee fees left over from the 80s.

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:rofl::rofl::rofl::rofl::+1:t5:

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nah, yours is based on fear.

It is simply not logical to accept things which are provably false. Ukraine applying to NATO for membership was not then and is not now a threat to Russia. There are many reasons for this including the fact that Ukraine could not have been granted accession due to its territorial dispute with Russia. Not to mention the fact that Ukraine was never going to get unanimous approval. NATO did not and never would attack Russia, and nothing NATO does is a threat to them so long as they do not attack NATO. Russian paranoia is not a consideration and should never be a factor is any decision we make.

It is simply irrational to believe that if Russia was allowed to succeed in its nuclear blackmail they wouldn’t do it again. If it worked, of course they would. They already use the same rhetoric and positions regarding the Baltics they used describing Ukraine before. If you want to stop WW3, the time to do it is now, and the way to do it is to ensure the Russian aggression fails.

No fee fees involved, except your fear.

What I am afraid of?

Are you Russia?

Not true. Any rule made by man can be changed by man.

:rofl: the faith…

Ibid

Blind in one eye. Only one country has ever used them. Was it Russia? Nyet.

You are regurgibleeting Ukranian propaganda in confirmation bias.

Go join them. Go fight.

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What am I afreaid of? What you haven’t seen?

I don’t have to be to not give a ■■■■ about their paranoid delusions

was it changed? no

They are attempting to use them as a tool for blackmail right now. You would let them.

Ben. How many western police actions and expansions have you served in?

How many innocent civilians have you seen who were victims of mistakes in intel, grid coordinates and human error?

I say war is wrong and all peace options should be placed on the table.

My heart goes out to the innocents who are are suffering and perishing.

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Lets go back to Nagasaki and Hiroshima and the suffering of the innocent people on the ground there. Read thier accounts and visit the memorials.

After you visit we can have an honest discussion.