OxyContin creators being sued by state of Colorado

zantax · 2018-09-11T10:48:50.127Z

TheDoctorIsIn:

What distinction are you trying to make?

How are they different?

If you are taking pain medication as prescribed for legitimate pain you are physically dependent but not an addict. Here let the government explain it to you.

from Is there a difference between physical dependence and addiction? | National Institute on Drug Abuse (NIDA)

Is there a difference between physical dependence and addiction?

Yes. Addiction—or compulsive drug use despite harmful consequences—is characterized by an inability to stop using a drug; failure to meet work, social, or family obligations; and, sometimes (depending on the drug), tolerance and withdrawal. The latter reflect physical dependence in which the body adapts to the drug, requiring more of it to achieve a certain effect (tolerance) and eliciting drug-specific physical or mental symptoms if drug use is abruptly ceased (withdrawal). Physical dependence can happen with the chronic use of many drugs—including many prescription drugs, even if taken as instructed. Thus, physical dependence in and of itself does not constitute addiction, but it often accompanies addiction. This distinction can be difficult to discern, particularly with prescribed pain medications, for which the need for increasing dosages can represent tolerance or a worsening underlying problem, as opposed to the beginning of abuse or addiction.

zantax · 2018-09-11T10:52:32.063Z

TheDoctorIsIn:

Janet_Miller:

Do explain how some of us use those painkillers like Oxycontin & don’t get addicted while others use just enough to get them through a few days discomfort & pitch the rest in the trash.

Anyone who takes strong opiate painkillers daily for more than a few weeks is addicted to them.

Period, full stop. This is a fact of human physiology.

Wrong, dependent or having built a tolerance is not the same as addicted.

Janet_Miller · 2018-09-11T11:10:58.616Z

Key word—daily.

And I am going to assume these individuals have a serious physical injury or illness that they regularly need those painkillers.

Wanna try for untreated scoliosis that requires another’s assistance to get into & out of bed & hope aspirin kills the pain?

Or have a piece of tendon grafted onto another & assume the pain will go away all by itself in two weeks or less?

Wrong on both counts. And a person who takes the dose prescribed for that particular pain only isn’t an addict. They’re taking what they need to manage that level of pain.

zantax · 2018-09-11T11:28:07.038Z

Addiction has a psychological component, it is not merely the building up of a tolerance or physical dependence. It includes a compulsion to use them to the detriment of your work and social life, taking them for a long period, as prescribed, for legitimate pain, doesn’t make you an addict. It is when you start taking more than prescribed or taking them after you no longer need them for pain that you cross the line to addiction.

I can drink for a month straight, and have in my younger years, I would and did build up a tolerance, and then return to having an occasional glass of wine with dinner once or twice a week or one or two beers on a Friday night, and have, that doesn’t make me an alcoholic. I think the longest I was on Vicodin was three weeks, that happened over a decade ago, I took them as prescribed for actual pain. When the pain was gone, I stopped and haven’t used pain meds outside of an occasional tylenol since.

AngraMainyu · 2018-09-11T12:00:15.763Z

Anecdote time. An ER doc prescribed me a weeks worth of vicodin when I showed up with the early stages of pneumonia. Probably because I told him I was going to work the next day.
At any rate, opioids are ■■■■■■■ awful. I threw away the script after 3 days.

zantax · 2018-09-11T12:03:19.572Z

AngraMainyu:

Anecdote time. An ER doc prescribed me a weeks worth of vicodin when I showed up with the early stages of pneumonia. Probably because I told him I was going to work the next day.
At any rate, opioids are ■■■■■■■ awful. I threw away the script after 3 days.

Seems like a weird thing to prescribe Vicodin for. And I agree they should be a last resort and not used lightly.

AngraMainyu · 2018-09-11T12:07:44.649Z

My GP thought so as well. They did give me a lot of energy for work, though. But the side effects were too much.
I’ll stick to liquor.

TheRedComet · 2018-09-11T12:14:03.591Z

I was never a fan of opioids.

I was into ■■■■ like Klonopin and Xanax. And whisky.

I had to quit all of it. I was a borderline addict at one point. There’s a line. Once you cross that line, you’ve become a junkie. I was fortunate enough to realize where I was headed and made the appropriate changes. The pills were easy to quit surprisingly. The whisky was much harder and I had some rough weeks.

Spartacus · 2018-09-11T12:48:47.861Z

Ignorance is bliss for some I suppose

reflechissez · 2018-09-11T14:58:04.061Z

Smyrna:

TheDoctorIsIn:

Oxycontin has only been on the market for about 20 years.

We’re not talking about ancient history here.

In 2002 I got into a car accident and it was known then.

That was 16 years ago. What’s your point?

Smyrna · 2018-09-11T15:07:39.394Z

reflechissez:

That was 16 years ago. What’s your point?

A doctor can not honestly say, they weren’t aware of the addicting component of this drug when prescribing it.

TommyLucchese · 2018-09-11T15:15:56.404Z

Smyrna:

A doctor can not honestly say, they weren’t aware of the addicting component of this drug when prescribing it.

I know you guys reflexively defend all big corporations because reasons but Purdue was still actively deceiving both the public and doctors specifically about how addictive OxyContin was, claiming it was less addictive than Vikes or Percs.

You can go and watch the videos they were sending doctors until the early 2000s claiming it was not only less addictive but so much less addictive that it could safely be prescribed for things like chronic arthritis which no one will even prescribe Vicodin for.

TommyLucchese · 2018-09-11T15:18:09.978Z

The very first guy I ever knew who transitioned from eating Oxys to becoming a full blown junkie was in 2001 and even then the tidal wave didn’t become obvious for a couple more years and I was watching from Ground Zero.

Smyrna · 2018-09-11T15:20:57.820Z

TommyLucchese:

I know you guys reflexively defend all big corporations because reasons but Purdue was still actively deceiving both the public and doctors specifically about how addictive OxyContin was, claiming it was less addictive than Vikes or Percs.

You can go and watch the videos they were sending doctors until the early 2000s claiming it was not only less addictive but so much less addictive that it could safely be prescribed for things like chronic arthritis which no one will even prescribe Vicodin for.

No dude…you’ve pegged me wrong. I want all who benefitted financially, at the expense of others…prosecuted.

In the year 2002, my wife who is a nurse was very careful about the pain medicine given me and she made it clear that these drugs were HIGHLY ADDICTIVE. I ended up on a fentanyl patch which she monitored very closely.

Janet_Miller · 2018-09-11T18:20:06.294Z

Gee that’s funny. The young man in the post above yours gave up various substances BEFORE they became an addiction.

HE was able to make a choice. Even 12 Step fellowships teach their members that they can choose to use or not use.

I’m tired of being asked to sympathize with those who make their own problems, & those in need of relief from serious injury & illness pain shouldn’t be sacrificed for them.

Quoting Bill Maher “I’m tired of having my choices circumscribed by society’s desire to preserve its lowest elements.”

AngraMainyu · 2018-09-11T18:26:47.761Z

They are easier. The only thing is that benzo and alcohol withdrawal can kill you.

AngraMainyu · 2018-09-11T18:31:34.600Z

I hear you. It sucks, but at some point there are too many addicts. We crossed that point and now everyone has to suffer so we don’t descend further.
There were several calls a day for ODs in my small city. Some people were saved by Narcan, others were found sometime after they were dead.

hwyflier · 2018-09-11T18:45:43.469Z

manufacturers choose their distributors, and when you’re choosing distributors who are sending enough pills to knockout a million people to cities of one thousand, something is up.

Janet_Miller · 2018-09-11T19:39:21.088Z

No one—particularly those whose pain is strong and not short term—should have to suffer.

And why should they, with the regular monitoring of drug levels that is taking place with these substances?

Private_Idaho · 2018-09-11T19:45:26.575Z

It doesn’t take long for these drugs to put their hooks in you. I got sick with cancer 3 years ago and was put a regimen of fentanyl patches and oxycodone which I stayed on for about 5 mons (I recovered thankfully). Never exceeded my prescribed dose. When I quit them I felt like death warmed over for about 4 day, couldn’t sleep for a week and was kind of depressed for a couple months after. Just goes to show that you can quickly get physically dependent on opiates even though you’re not addicted. I really would advise people to try to steer clear of these drugs if possible, although if you’re suffering with acute pain there are really no alternatives to opiates. They do work at killing pain.