Lost the Faith of a Child or Kept the Faith

[Dem]

@Guvnah

Then it’s no longer faith. It awe. Or amazement. Or even coercion.

You’re correct, it’s no longer faith. Though one could argue, that the coercion is already there, with the threat of hell and all.

[Dem]

@Meriweather

Correct. Truth is found in more than one book, Biblical truth being one.

Hmm. That isn’t Christian teaching. Do you feel Hinduism, Buddhism etc. have truth and paths to God?

@Meriweather

Actually I am not. I am removing modern man’s conclusion that we are more intelligent than ancient man. Sure, we have more knowledge, but I would argue sometimes ancient man shows more wisdom.

A deeper understanding of ancient myths about Thor and Zeus would suggest differently. They may once have been rulers of old who upon their passing assumed the stature of gods. It appears events in their physical lives became the basis of godly myths. I love mythology–especially Greek and Roman. There is a lot more to it than is commonly known. If it hadn’t been for Judaism and Christianity, we may have had the gods of Mount Rushmore with Washington and Lincoln taking the places of Zeus and Thor.

@Meriweather

Now there you are incorrect. Catholics, Orthodox, Jews never saw the entire Bible as literal–still don’t. It was in the 1970s that Evangelicals began a big push that everyone should take the Bible literally. Perhaps it is fairly modern Evangelical thought nowadays that perhaps the 1970s push was not well thought out?

Interesting. Do you have sources on these two points, or are they more personal belief?

@Meriweather

I recommend the Catholic Study Bible, particularly the footnotes. I also think it is vital to read the Old Testament not only with these footnotes, but with good, scholarly rabbinical commentary.

Thanks. Looks like I’ll be getting an Ignatius RSV2CE study Bible.

[Dem]

@FlameHeart

About being Catholic. I have discovered that some of the Catholics helped the Nazis escape arrest after WWII. I can’t defend that.

Meh, there are good Catholics and bad Catholics. Just like there are good Protestants and bad Protestants. This is just humans being human. The Church has gone through many, many scandals throughout it’s existence. Speaking as an atheist, I wouldn’t let them color you on the faith itself.

I would suggest speaking with a Priest, and seeing if the faith is right for you.

[Borgia_dude]

@FlameHeart

Borgia- is this enough for you? Did Jesus do enough?

Yes, there certainly was immense sacrifice in those passages.

[Dem]

@FlameHeart

Borgia doesn’t understand that God did pay us- because Jesus died on the cross. He saved us all.

I never really got this. I get the meaning behind it and symbolism. But dying on the cross doesn’t seem like a big deal to an all powerful and eternal being. Just a blip in his existence.

[Borgia_dude]

@Dem

@FlameHeart

Borgia doesn’t understand that God did pay us- because Jesus died on the cross. He saved us all.

I never really got this. I get the meaning behind it and symbolism. But dying on the cross doesn’t seem like a big deal to an all powerful and eternal being. Just a blip in his existence.

It is a bit strange when you you think of it objectively. God sacrificed Himself to Himself to save us from Himself for rules He created.

[Guvnah]

@FlameHeart

It’s not that. People give a bad image, people think of us as bad.

AND … ??

If you’re a particular chosen religion, it should be for what the religion offers, and what it teaches, and for what makes it different from other religions. Catholicism offers you something no other religion does. (PM me if you don’t know what that is.) That difference exists no matter what any other Catholic says or does. It doesn’t change. And it cannot be diminished by anyone or anything. It doesn’t matter what others think about Catholics and Catholicism. Nothing is worth abandoning it, if you truly believe in it. (Which is why I said that if you let other things take you away from it, your faith is shallow.)

[Scratch]

Never had it…Even as a young child, the bible just didn’t add up. Animism would be more in the line with the way I see things.

[Guvnah]

@FlameHeart

Maybe I should just have a conversation with a priest.

Not just “maybe”.

And it doesn’t matter what drew you to it in the first place. What matters is that you need to know what you say you believe in now.

A priest would help you far more than I could.

[Guvnah]

@FlameHeart

Hold on, was that just an insult?

Absolutely not.

[Meriweather]

@Dem

Hmm. That isn’t Christian teaching. Do you feel Hinduism, Buddhism etc. have truth and paths to God?

Those who follow Jesus have his instructions on bringing people into the Kingdom of God. As is pointed out in the Catholic catechism, we leave others in the loving hands of God. God has a way of meeting people where they are and drawing them closer to Him. I have great faith in the Holy Spirit.

[Meriweather]

@Dem

Interesting. Do you have sources on these two points, or are they more personal belief?

I was alive in the 70s and lived through this–had several Evangelical friends. My Catholic grandmother, an avid Bible reader, didn’t take it literally, and neither did her mother and grandmother.

There were articles about this at the time, so I imagine you could find information on line. I also remember a nun telling my class that the Catholic Church is fine with people taking everything literally if that is important to them.

[Meriweather]

@Dem

I never really got this. I get the meaning behind it and symbolism. But dying on the cross doesn’t seem like a big deal to an all powerful and eternal being. Just a blip in his existence.

Something I don’t think is pointed out enough is the trouble Jesus was in for declaring, “Sins are forgiven.” While this is obvious to us today–more than obvious, at the time it reached the level of a scandal and Jesus was ordered to cease and desist. Or else. He wouldn’t. He kept insisting sins are forgiven and that he was anointed by God to proclaim this message. The religious leaders of the time demanded he prove he had the authority to teach sins are forgiven. We all know what the response was and what happened next.

[Meriweather]

@Borgia_dude

It is a bit strange when you you think of it objectively. God sacrificed Himself to Himself to save us from Himself for rules He created.

Jesus gave his life to assure humanity sins are forgiven; repentance for the forgiveness of sins.

[Dem]

@Meriweather

@Borgia_dude

It is a bit strange when you you think of it objectively. God sacrificed Himself to Himself to save us from Himself for rules He created.

Jesus gave his life to assure humanity sins are forgiven; repentance for the forgiveness of sins.

We get it. We’re just saying it’s an odd way to go about it. Gods way of creating a new covenant, was to have himself be born as a child, live as a child, preach as a man, and then sacrifice himself. Definitely different than how OT God would have handled it.

[Dem]

@Meriweather

Those who follow Jesus have his instructions on bringing people into the Kingdom of God. As is pointed out in the Catholic catechism, we leave others in the loving hands of God. God has a way of meeting people where they are and drawing them closer to Him. I have great faith in the Holy Spirit.

This is definitely a theologically liberal view.

[Guvnah]

@Dem

We’re just saying it’s an odd way to go about it. Gods way of creating a new covenant, was to have himself be born as a child, live as a child, preach as a man, and then sacrifice himself. Definitely different than how OT God would have handled it.

See Old Testament: Isaiah 55:9

[Meriweather]

@Dem

This is definitely a theologically liberal view.

The Catholic Catechism is liberal?

[Meriweather]

@Dem

Definitely different than how OT God would have handled it.

How do you think God would have handled it?

[Meriweather]

@Scratch

Never had it…Even as a young child, the bible just didn’t add up

Can you give us a description of what you didn’t see as adding up?