Jerusalem Post: 58% of hospitalized COVID cases were fully vaccinated

My understanding is that most of the vaccines in Israel came from Pfizer.

The virus is quickly evolving to get around the vaccines. Immunity is far from perfect and may be temporary.

The good news is that the news variants appear to be less lethal, and the vaccines appear to be providing some protection against death at least for now.

Another reason to get vaccinated

The greater the portion of people who are vaccinated, the more evolutionary pressure there is for new variants that get around the vaccines.

Your vaccination is making mine less effective.

The good news is that the natural evolution is for viruses to become more contagious but less deadly. COVID may become just another cold virus.

pretty sure you have that backwards, but here is to hoping Covid becomes just another cold virus! :beer:

Many cold viruses are coronaviruses. That is the natural evolution.

Common Human Coronaviruses | CDC

A more sober assessment of the Israeli findings that puts the data in a little more context.

Two key aspects…illness that pre-vaccine was classified as “serious” because it usually signaled a patient was about to deteriorate now is just a temporary condition for the vaccinated.

The remaining unvaccinated in Israel are mostly COVID skeptic’s who likely aren’t getting tested when they get sick, skewing the numbers.

One small set of numbers that shows more vaccinated than unvaccinated is a terrible way to claim a diminishing effectiveness and shows a lack of understanding of statistics. Easy to have a “snapshot in time” where a patient group would have more vaccinated than unvaccinated. This pattern would have to be more sustained over time with much larger sample numbers before we could make such a claim the vaccine was losing effectiveness. And that’s not happening.

I see that the biggest danger is authoritarian government who wants to restrict information to prevent people from making their own choices.

Many viruses really do just disappear. Another possibility is that the symptoms become so mild no one even recognizes that they have had the disease, sort of a naturally occurring vaccination.

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Yes, given the high rate of vaccination among those who are most vulnerable the vaccine appears to have some value.

On the other hand, the effectiveness of the vaccine appears to be dropping rapidly as new variants continue to evolve. I expect that in a few months governments will be pushing annual shots.

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If it’s proven effective yes. Or maybe they should be working on new vaccine using traditional methods.

Just thinking out loud here.

Meanwhile the Biden Administration is balking at providing data on breakthrough cases:

https://twitter.com/i/status/1418633268669427713

People have a right to know. Doesn’t bold well when they keep things from us…and thus the reason for mistrust.

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Instead of improving trust, they make things worse.

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Yes, my assumption is that anything from Biden’s experts and the mainstream media is just propaganda until proven otherwise.

I am hardly alone. Trust in media is at record low, and their “solution” is proposed draconian censorship rather than actually reporting news instead of pure propaganda.

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58 % of Israelis are fully vaccinated and 58% of Covid hospitalizations in Israel were full vaccinated.

Snake oil?

The party line from the Biden administration is that vaccines are highly effective and the unvaccinated are the only people getting seriously ill from COVID. If that is true, then the only justification for the return to mask mandates in Los Angeles is to protect the unvaccinated from each other.

People choose to do a lot of things that others find to be dangerous or foolhardy. Some engage in promiscuous sexual activity risking exposure to a wide variety of nasty diseases. Others choose to jump out of plane, jump off bridges, or ride motorcycles through rush hour traffic without a helmet. It is a free country.

Meanwhile governments are trying to figure out how to force people to get vaccinated. Given the history of lies and misinformation from the government and the “experts”, there are good reasons for people to be skeptical.

My observation is that the benefits of the vaccinations appear to be temporary and self limiting. The greater the portion of the population with vaccinations, the faster the evolution of virus strains that bypass resistance from the vaccines. Development of new vaccines is far behind the evolution of new strains. We are playing a game of whack-a-mole.

My opinion is that the vaccines have real dangers and real benefits. Each person should be able to make their own informed decision. According to the official line, the only people who are endangered by those who choose not to vaccinate are the other unvaccinated. Why the arm twisting for vaccinations?

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Well said :clap:

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Let’s test the claim that the greater the vaccination rate the faster the evolution of virus strains. The delta variant originated in India. Currently, they have around 24% of their population who have received one shot and around 6% have received two.

Antibody tests showed that over 50% of the population poorer areas of the cities of India by July 2020. The variant probably developed to infect people who had some existing immunity from earlier exposure to the virus.

Seroprevalence of SARS-CoV-2 in slums and non-slums of Mumbai, India, during June 29-July 19, 2020 | NCRC (jhsph.edu)

What exactly does that study show to substantiate the claim?

. . . participants randomly sampled in slum communities in Mumbai, India had a 54.1% seroprevalence of IgG antibodies to SARS-CoV-2 infection . . .

The vaccines are designed to produce similar antibodies. The new variant most likely developed to bypass immunity from previous infections, which is why it bypassing the vaccines as well.

The virus continues to evolve quickly and the vaccines are designed for variants that existed over a year ago. Whack a mole.

Whac-A-Mole CHAMP!!! - YouTube

Here is a report from a few weeks ago on the spread of the variant among the vaccinated in the US: