It was warmer 1000 and 2000 years ago


#142

Hey Samm, you’re cool. I’m glad that you’re engaged in this and you make some good points.


#143

Humans have learned to adapt to our climate. Our cities are along the coast. Our farms are in land suitable for each crop.

If that climate changes, it doesn’t mean the end of our species. Not even close. But it certainly would be costly to shift farm production, for example.


#144

OK. Agreed that the species is not in danger. And I’m not a climate alarmist. But what I believe is that there are converging crises including, but not limited to: the availability of fresh water, the availability of rare elements and minerals, the limit to extraction of fossil fuels, depletion of oceanic fisheries, unrelenting habitat destruction, etc., etc.

Here’s a question. Would the worldwide availability of fresh water have been affected without human influence?


#145

It is not backwards. You challenged me. Prove it.


#146

Do you want the simple answer?

The same thing that has caused it to warm up in the past.

But in truth, warm is a relative thing. Earth today may be warmer than it was 200 years ago, but it is probably cooler than it was 5000 years ago and much cooler than it was 10 million years ago. There is no neutral point to temperature on Earth. The normal range has been from much warmer to much colder from the beginning and there is no reason except man’s arrogance to believe that the temperature should remain exactly where people want it to be. Heck, even amongst us humans, we cannot agree on the ideal temperature.


#147

Thank you. I appreciate that. But some people here are intent on making the discussion about me not the subject. I guess that’s because they have nothing of substance to add to the conversation. Ho hum.


#148

That is exactly right. (Hear that dantes?) Rather than pretending that they can do anything about changing climates, people need to adapt to the inevitable. The historic record is littered with dead civilizations that did not adapt to climate changes in the past.


#149

Yes. Man its quite capable of making fresh water out of non-potable water.


#150

No, that’s backwards. Where I come from, the people making the claims are responsible for backing it up.

I don’t know where you come from.


#151

Samm,
To answer a previous post, you are correct. People sometimes are disposed to shoot the messenger, not the message. As to the point here, you are correct. We can produce potable water from non-potable water. Think sewage and water boards. But consider this, why is the water not potable in the first place?

Or am I misunderstanding your comment?


#152

Hey listen, Samm. I’ve got to sign off. I’m the chef in the family and I’m now on duty. We will meet again. I may not agree with you all the time, but I think you are an earnest dude.


#155

The vast majority of water on Earth has not been potable (fit for human consumption) since life began. Without looking it up, I think its in the magnitude of 98-99% of water is fresh, and most of that is locked up in ice. Yes, man pollutes a lot of water, but that is not the primary cause of fresh water shortages. Most of the shortage is caused by over consumption and waste, particularly in marginally dry areas such as Southern California.

Point of interest. I live in a desert. Our annual precipitation is about 10-12 inches. Yet we have no water shortage. Mostly that is because the evaporation rate is so low, but also, there just are not enough of us living here to make a dent. Best of both worlds. :wink:


#156

Civilization is basically screwed.


#157

Lame dodge. Just admit the data doesn’t exist.


#158

Yet when asked to support yours you dodge and hide.


#159

Of course we are. We are always at risk of a new ice age and we’re overdue for the next one to begin.


#160

No we haven’t. We have learned to adapt our environment to make it suitable for human life.

Human tolerance for broad shifts in temperature alone is very narrow, we can’t adapt to live in water for any length of time either which considering 2/3 of the planet is covered in water limits us greatly.


#161

There is no ideal temperature. There probably is an ideal temperature range for human life.

So we are currently warming, right?


#162

Maybe our global warming is forestalling it?


#163

My point is climate shifts cost us resources. We’ll adapt but there is a cost.