If Hitler had won

I found this article to be interesting.
It details some things the Nazis intended to do had they won the war.
Some of these things I had heard before, some I hadn’t.
Here are a few I found the most interesting.

  1. Giant space mirror. A mirror 1 mile in diameter in orbit 22,000 miles in space. It would be tilted to reflect the Sun’s rays on offending cities and reduce them to ashes.

  2. Returning land back to the American Indians. Hitler was a big fan of the American Indians. This probably came from his fondness for the Wild West novels of German author Karl May.

  3. Converting Eastern Europe to Jehovah’s Witness. Himmler greatly respected the fanatical work ethic and pacifism of Jehovah’s Witnesses. He thought it would make the perfect religion for slave laborers.

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And good riddance!

I’m obsessed with history of the Third Reich,I own over 500 books on the subject and I have never heard of half of that in any serious peer reviewed history books.

Which half have you heard of, though?

I did a search on Nazis and Native Americans… there are a few articles about that in mainstream media sites (which I trust a lot more than sites like "answers.yahoo.com), and that one seems to be true.

Yes I had heard of the Native American one before although it was mostly propaganda from Goebbels.The enslavement of Europe and the encouraging of Muslim dominance of the Middle East and a Greater Japan empire are well known.

As for the rest,as in the case of Jehovahs Witness statement by Himmler,it was probably an off the cuff remark or later claims after the war by former Nazi’s. The plans for England were never seriously planned after the failure of Operation Sea Lion.

Sea Lion didn’t fail. It wasn’t attempted.

Yes you’re right,it was dependant on aerial supremacy and after the Battle of Britain they knew it couldn’t succeed.

Actually Himmler wrote a detailed letter about it. (Just found the site.)

  1. We must support any form or kind of religion or sect that would have a pacifying effect. For all the Turkic peoples, the introduction of the Buddhist teaching comes to mind here, for everyone else - the teachings of Jehovah’s Witnesses.

As you should know, Jehovah’s Witnesses have the following extremely useful qualities for us:

Except for military service and work for military purposes, i.е. use for, as they say “destructive” activities, Jehovah’s Witnesses are extremely opposed to the Jews, against the Catholic Church and the Pope. They are incredibly sensible, do not drink or smoke, are extremely diligent and very honest, keep the word, are excellent cattle-breeders and peasants, are not fixated on wealth and prosperity, since it hinders eternal life. In general, these are all - ideal qualities. It can be concluded that the core of convinced, idealistic witnesses of Jehovah possesses enviable good qualities like Mennonites.

The Sun Gun (space mirror) was a real Nazi project. It was budgeted for 3,000,000 Reichs Marks and was estimated to take 15 years to complete.
GOOGLE it. There are a number of references to it.

Wernher von Braun tried to sell the idea to the U.S. Government in 1961 to use against the U.S.S.R. , but there was no interest.

Hi Tommy quick question maybe you have across in your studies, because I don’t buy the response I have read from mostly news articles on the issue.

Germany has 12,000 tons of Sarin gas and as we know they didn’t care to gas people and the eastern theater was hell on earth. Have you ran into the reason why he didn’t authorize the use of Sarin on the eastern front especially after or during Stalingrad when things went for the worse? They had the means to deliver it as well.

The news article response I have seen was Hitler didn’t want to use the gas because he was gassed in WW2. I think that’s dubious at best considering the savagery on the eastern front, as well as the gas that was used to kill prisoners.

Goering was asked this question after he was captured by the Allies. His answer was “the horses”. If the Germans used gas, their enemies would have used it. The German Army moved, primarily, by horse drawn transport. There was no effective way to protect the horses from gas attacks

Stuff like that should not be tossed out without a specific reference to the source. No source, don’t take it seriously.

As to projections of what would have happened if Hitler had won, it would obviously in the short run been a disaster just based on what they were doing during the years they did have power.
As for the long run…if the Soviet Union had lost and someone would have written a book on the future if the Soviet Union had won, would they include “some 60 years after their victory they would have dissolved themselves and broken into many independent small states”.?
Its just a guess after a while.

I took that in consideration especially at the first of the war with the constant offenses and victories and in the west. But somewhere after Kursk they were primarily on the defense throughout the war which wouldn’t have effected the horses so much and they had to know what was coming for them in terms of revenge from the East.

I remember in one of my elective classes in college dealing with modern war history the question was asked something like. If the U.S. and Russia went to war who would use nuclear weapons first. And the teacher a former captain in the marines if memory serves correct said “Whoever starts losing the conventional war”.

It would have seemed knowing that the country is about to be laid to rubble and massive country men and women dead the desperation would have set in to use them and to hell with the :horse: :slight_smile:

We know Hitler could have used Saren gas and we also know he didn’t.
We have the explanation of Goering, the Deputy Fuhrer, as to why he didn’t use it. I’ll take that as true unless something more convincing comes along.

Here is an excerpt from Goering’s Nuremberg testimony:

Q. We know you had Gas Blau, which would have stopped the Normandy invasion. Why didn’t you use it?

A. Die Pferde (the horses).

Q. What have horses to do with it?

A. Everything. A horse lies down in the shafts or between the thills as soon as his breathing is restricted. We never have had a gas mask a horse would tolerate.

Q. What has that to do with Normandy?

A. We did not have enough gasoline to adequately supply the German Air Force and the Panzer Divisions, so we used horse transport in all operations. You must have known that the first thing we did in Poland, France, everywhere, was to seize the horses. All our material was horse-drawn. Had we used gas you would have retaliated and you would have instantly immobilized us.

Q. Was it that serious, Marshal?

A. I tell you, you would have won the war years ago if you had used gas – not on our soldiers, but on our transportation system. Your intelligence men are asses!

Thanks for the article but they are talking specifically of Normandy and while it was a brutal conflict nothing in comparison to the atrocities that took place in the East were it was a war of extermination.

Further the article goes into the same speculation that I have read before about Hitlers exposure to gas in WW1 which I can understand not wanting that in the western conflicts which seemed a war they didn’t want to fight but in the East its hard to believe they didn’t unleash it by at least 1944 when the Soviet advance looked unstoppable.

What applied to Normandy would have applied to any battle or series of battles. The German’s horses could not have been protected against enemy gas attacks. The German war machine would have been brought to a stand still. Goering said we could have won the war years before 1945 if we had gassed their horses. The horse situation was not unique to Normandy.

Hi somebody beat me to it.Hitler was adverse to using gas,partially due to his experiences in the war and partly because he knew that it would open a can of worms in so much as it would also get used by the allies on the Germans.Churchill was on record as saying he would deploy gas if used on allied troops,in fact he wanted to gas German cities in that event.
Canaris who was head of military Intelligence,who was a traitor,wrongly told Hitler the allies had developed Nerve Gas and that may also have had some bearing on his thinking.

As somebody already mentioned,the way the German’s relied on horses and the blitzkrieg method of warfare wouldn’t have suited the use of gas.

I have never come across this before and as it was so late in the war I have doubts this was ever taken seriously.The Cossacks did fight for the Nazis against the Soviets and I can believe he did consider things like this.There is no reference to this in the only authoritative primary source work on Kaltenbrunner.

After a bit of digging I did find reference to Himmler saying something like this in a talk with some senior SS men including Karl Wolff,I haven’t come across any letters.It is a pity that link is in Russian

Have you seen the Amazon Prime Video series The Man in the High Castle? It’s depicts what might have become of the United States after axis powers win WWII. It is VERY compelling, very well done.

Yes I have I enjoyed it though it gets quite perplexing at times.