Government shutdown

[Striker840]

@Sknyluv

@conan

So tell me…who are those people that are unable to get ID?

Generally speaking the people who have the most barriers to obtaining a current ID are the elderly, people with disabilities, students, people in rural communities, ethnic minorities, and low-income individuals. I posted the below in another thread a few weeks ago.

Two things to note first. One. No one is saying this is a rampant problem. A vast majority of eligible voters do have ID. The problem is, if you are going to require ID, you can’t ignore the fact that some people, not a lot, but some people don’t have the required ID. Two. Most people can obtain an ID, but the issue is how difficult, costly, and burdensome is it to obtain that ID. Again, we’re not saying this is a widespread problem, but there are certain groups of people that have a harder time than others obtaining an ID. Those groups include the elderly, people with disabilities, students, people in rural communities, ethnic minorities, and low-income individuals. Each group have their own reasons why it’s difficult to obtain a current ID, whether that be lack of source documents, cost, transportation barriers, mobility/health issues, or bureaucratic complexity.

Other than the elderly and those with disabilities, the rest I call ■■■■■■■■ on. They just generally don’t want to put any effort into getting one. I live in a rual community, there is always at least one place in every county in Ohio to get an ID. It just may take a little effort finding a ride, and even that is available in my county thru a small transportation service here

In today’s culture, people expect things to simply be handed to them without any effort at all on their end to obtain it.

As far as the elderly and disabled, there are programs that currently exist to assist them as well. They are underutilized because of a lack of knowledge of the programs.

We as a society need to stop encouraging laziness and dependence on others to do what one needs to do.

[Striker840]

@Publius

@Samm

@Sknyluv

@conan

So tell me…who are those people that are unable to get ID?

Generally speaking the people who have the most barriers to obtaining a current ID are the elderly, people with disabilities, students, people in rural communities, ethnic minorities, and low-income individuals. I posted the below in another thread a few weeks ago.

Two things to note first. One. No one is saying this is a rampant problem. A vast majority of eligible voters do have ID. The problem is, if you are going to require ID, you can’t ignore the fact that some people, not a lot, but some people don’t have the required ID. Two. Most people can obtain an ID, but the issue is how difficult, costly, and burdensome is it to obtain that ID. Again, we’re not saying this is a widespread problem, but there are certain groups of people that have a harder time than others obtaining an ID. Those groups include the elderly, people with disabilities, students, people in rural communities, ethnic minorities, and low-income individuals. Each group have their own reasons why it’s difficult to obtain a current ID, whether that be lack of source documents, cost, transportation barriers, mobility/health issues, or bureaucratic complexity.

Do you know anyone who does not have an ID and doesn’t know how to get one?

If so, how do those people do any of the other things that require them to have an ID?

You don’t need RealID for everything. But if you’re talking RealID, that proves citizenship, you must appear in person in your state with the following:
Identity & Lawful Status (One Document): Valid U.S. Passport, original/certified U.S. Birth Certificate, Certificate of Naturalization, or valid Permanent Resident Card.
Social Security Number (One Document): Social Security Card, W-2 form, paystub, or 1099 form.
Proof of Residential Address (Two Documents): Must be recent. Examples include utility bills, mortgage statements, lease agreements, or bank statements.
Name Change Documents: If your current name differs from your birth certificate, you must provide legal proof of name change (e.g., marriage certificate, divorce decree, or court order).

I can see a number of things there that could make it very difficult and/or costly for some just to collect the necessary documents (people do lose things), not to mention appear in person to apply. Out of state college students, the homebound, married women with name changes, people in very rural areas - there are many others.

NONE of things are impossible, or even hard to get. If my 86 year old mom can locate and obtain her birth certificate from 1939 all on her own, anyone can likely do it. It may take some effort, assistance with using a computer to do some research, etc it IS doable. @you all are taking relatively small numbers of situations and making them out to be widespread problems.

[Striker840]

@tnt

@Samm

Do you know anyone who does not have an ID and doesn’t know how to get one?

If so, how do those people do any of the other things that require them to have an ID?

I promise you, if you work with, or volunteer with orgs that serve the communities ay mentioned, you know someone without ID, checking accounts, savings accounts, credit cards and a host of other things we all take for granted.

Then how do these people cash a check, obtain/renew government assistance, get even basic medical care, etc.

[Striker840]

@tnt

@bigtwnvin

People who don’t have an acceptable ID are IMO:

1. Too ■■■■■■■ lazy to get one.

Imagine an 85 yo person living alone, who no longer can drive and is cared for by their children.

When their license expires, why would they bother getting it renewed?

Because they need it for their banking, health care, housing. My mom is 86, she stopped driving last year BUT before she stopped driving she had finally gathered her documents to get an 8 year RealID qualified drivers license for Ohio.

Stop with your ■■■■■■■■ scenarios. Also, if they are cared for by their children…where is the so called barrier to them getting/keeping a valid ID?

[Striker840]

@Samm

@Sknyluv

@Samm

Any infirm or elderly care resident has the human resources at their bidding to help them get an ID if they are incapable of getting one themselves.

An assumption.

@Samm

And people in rural areas routinely obtain government issued IDs.

Of course they do. But being farther from somewhere that provides the needed ID is a legitimate barrier.

@Samm

There simply is no valid excuse for exposing the voting process to potential fraud by not ensuring that the person voting and their cast ballot is legitimate.

You can’t prevent all fraud. And in person fraud rarely yo never happens. There are already plenty of safeguards in place to prevent fraud. The potential for in person voter fraud is a Trojan horse used to hide the true purpose of keeping people from voting.

@Samm

This transference of the “if it saves just one life” principle to voting process is pathetically absurd.

“If it prevents one fraudulent vote.”

A valid assumption.

“Barrier” is subjective. Everything worthwhile that we do requires some effort.

You are right, we can’t prevent all fraud, but we can close the obvious gaps. Requiring an ID does that.

It will prevent more than one fraudulent vote. Mission accomplished.

All I am seeing from some posters are simply excuses to allow people to be lazy, and not put in ANY effort to get an ID.

[Guvnah]

@Striker840

It may take some effort, assistance with using a computer to do some research, etc it IS doable.

And many churches and community centers have free assistance programs to help those who are struggling with things like this. (Including tax filing!)

People putting in so much effort to conjure up excuses for imaginary scenarios should devote that effort to helping out at these services.

[tnt]

@Striker840

Then how do these people cash a check, obtain/renew government assistance, get even basic medical care, etc.

If they don’t have a checking account, they don’t cash checks obviously. They use cash or money orders. A lot of them don’t get basic medical assistance. A lot of them don’t get the other government programs available to them.

A lot of time in charitable organizations is spent working on this very problem. Helping people get the basics…ID, checking accounts, a savings account…basic things we all take for granted.

I know this sounds impossible, and it’s kind of geographically dependent. But, go to any economically depressed urban center and speak to the orgs serving these communities. It’s shocking.

[bigtwnvin]

Again, the excuses are for ballot harvesting. The sooner mail in ballots ( except absentees with qualified reasons), are ■■■■ canned the better for everyone.

[Striker840]

@Guvnah

@Striker840

It may take some effort, assistance with using a computer to do some research, etc it IS doable.

And many churches and community centers have free assistance programs to help those who are struggling with things like this. (Including tax filing!)

People putting in so much effort to conjure up excuses for imaginary scenarios should devote that effort to helping out at these services.

EXACTLY, but no that takes something called effort, or initiative, something many obviously lack.

[Striker840]

@tnt

@Striker840

Then how do these people cash a check, obtain/renew government assistance, get even basic medical care, etc.

If they don’t have a checking account, they don’t cash checks obviously. They use cash or money orders. A lot of them don’t get basic medical assistance. A lot of them don’t get the other government programs available to them.

A lot of time in charitable organizations is spent working on this very problem. Helping people get the basics…ID, checking accounts, a savings account…basic things we all take for granted.

I know this sounds impossible, and it’s kind of geographically dependent. But, go to any economically depressed urban center and speak to the orgs serving these communities. It’s shocking.

Then where do they get their cash from?

Oh and fyi, I grew up in one of those areas, I used to attend a church that provided a free hot meal every Wednesday (a program my dad started btw in 1980 that is still going today), and here is a little tidbit that I KNOW you will jump on, it was not uncommon to have 2 and sometimes 3 generations of the same family all on some type of govt assistance. It is a learned behavior and is often multi-generational. Its all they know, it’s how they grew up, and they have zero incentive to break the cycle.

[tnt]

@Striker840

Then where do they get their cash from?

Check cashing joints. Which is terrible because their is a fee that goes with that.

@Striker840

(a program my dad started btw in 1980 that is still going today)

That’s awesome.

[Striker840]

@tnt

@Striker840

Then where do they get their cash from?

Check cashing joints. Which is terrible because their is a fee that goes with that.

@Striker840

(a program my dad started btw in 1980 that is still going today)

That’s awesome.

Check cashing joints require ID to cash checks

[tnt]

@Striker840

@tnt

@Striker840

Then where do they get their cash from?

Check cashing joints. Which is terrible because their is a fee that goes with that.

@Striker840

(a program my dad started btw in 1980 that is still going today)

That’s awesome.

Blockquote

Check cashing joints require ID to cash checks

I was referring to the folks who don’t have checking accounts. Which just baffles me. I just don’t see how you get through a month without a check. But lots of people don’t do it.

I have a family member who has worked with inner city non-profits, and now works in housing for low income and homeless community members. The stories are pretty incredible. Often said, sometimes uplifting.

(Subject change - I have a client now, affluent, beautiful home…they asked how they pay, I said check, and they said ‘Huh? Boomer, we don’t use checks.’ So onn the other end of the spectrum suddenly people don’t use checks? All online banking? )

[RTchoke]

@tnt

I was referring to the folks who don’t have checking accounts.

And those check cashing places still require ID. Having a checking account has nothing to do with whether the check cashing stores ask for ID, so I’m confused what point you think you are making.

[tnt]

@RTchoke

@tnt

I was referring to the folks who don’t have checking accounts.

And those check cashing places still require ID. Having a checking account has nothing to do with whether the check cashing stores ask for ID, so I’m confused what point you think you are making.

Yes. I was referring to the people who don’t have checking accounts. If they are using the check cash counter, they would have ID.

[PAmoderate37]

Another week and this thread should have its name changed to DHS shutdown. This is going to be a very dumb move by Democrats. Them shutting down DHS will not impact CBP or ICE. However, it will impact TSA and FEMA greatly.