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Sounds complicated

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Bringing back people from the dead kinda shoots down the free will theory, doesn’t it?

He’ll bring back somebody from the dead, but will allow Hitler to kill 6 million Jews. What kind of love is that?

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I look back to accounts of Biblical times, early Chinese Dynasties, and Middle Eastern Culture. Like you, they believed:

  1. Floods, volcanic eruptions, and other natural disasters are caused by God.
  2. God chose their kings and emperors.
  3. God decided who won each battle–a sign of favor or punishment.
  4. Birth defects were God punishing the sins of the parents.
  5. When God no longer liked a ruler, He sent crop failures and withheld rain.

I can understand early man. He did not yet understand science. Have you, today, so little understanding of science? Other than an enjoyment of creating false gods, that is the only reason I can think of to hold fast to your superstitions. Mankind produced Hitler, allowed Hitler his reign, and stood by while Hitler did great evil. Now, totally shamed by what happened, like Eve, apparently some of mankind points to another and claims what man did was all God’s fault.

Through the ages mankind observed, and through this observation we learned a great deal about science. Christians had Christ (our first theological scientist, if you will) who also taught us to observe. But, instead of just observing nature, we observe–and as a result, relate–to God differently as well. We observe His love without our observations being warped by natural disasters and the sins of mankind.

Mankind’s learning of both science and of God are both now far greater than what you are presenting. Welcome to the 21st century. :wink:

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84

That’s a long winded way of saying God bears no responsibility for the world he created.

85

That’s convenient

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He had an “abnormally” high IQ as well, as told in the Gospel of Luke:

“After three days they found him in the temple, sitting among the teachers, listening to them and asking them questions; and all who heard him were amazed at his understanding and his answers.”

In 200 years, Einstein will sit in the footnotes of history along with Isaac Newton, as part of a Junior High requirement. Someone else’s picture will replace his, and billions will still pray in Jesus’ name.

87

Amen.

Here is another point: If one is truly interested in science and the advances in science, would they would not seek instruction from someone who only has the understanding of those living a century or more before; or from the Flat Earth Society; or from Young Earth Creationists; or someone with only a middle school or high school education of a dozen years ago. Instead, they would go to modern day scientists and scholars, and read up-to-date material.

I encourage the same with theology. Leave childhood’s understanding and its conclusions. Research, listen to/read modern theological scholars who include in their studies ancient languages, cultures, and histories. By understanding the ancient thoughts of God (He zaps natural disasters on the population, and personally chooses its kings) compared to what we have learned over the centuries, we can advance our own knowledge of God and how He truly works within one’s life, within our lives. We can understand God as an adult instead of as a child.

I’ve never understood how people fight current knowledge, whether that be in science or theology/God. Why refuse to expand, update, and renovate one’s own knowledge?

Again, God is not complicated. Begin with love and see how the perspective changes. Look for spiritual teachings, not floods, in the Old Testament. Why not try:

Be holy, for I, the LORD, your God, am holy.

“You shall not bear hatred for your brother or sister in your heart.
Though you may have to reprove your fellow citizen,
do not incur sin because of him.
Take no revenge and cherish no grudge against any of your people.
You shall love your neighbor as yourself.
I am the LORD.”

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88

As long as there are tests there will be prayers in schools.

And they’ll be just about as effective as they are anywhere else.

Unless people take matters into their own hands (for school kids, studying for their tests, for baseball players, actually working on their batting skills, for soldiers, having leaders who don’t put them in harms way for money or hotels), nothing gets done.

89

This conversation is not about science. It’s about the nature of God’s choice to not be more involved in world affairs, given his proclaimed benevolence.

God ignored science when he rose Jesus from the dead or walked on water. This notion that God is bound to the natural world is ridiculous.

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Ignorant people do ignorant things all the time (like pretending there is no God or that God will help them pass a test), especially when they consciously attempt to separate themselves from what they are. It’s a choice to be hollow on the inside looking for substance on the outside. :man_shrugging:

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Pot meet kettle

I love how anyone who disagrees with you is “hollow”

92

A great question, I have no idea why, how, or when, people choose to close their minds off like that, nor can I understand why people refuse to connect to their own spirit. I too used to hate myself on a similar level, but I never wanted to. I chalk this up as part of the mystery I’ve created for myself. :man_shrugging:

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No pretending required.

On the other hand, there’s only one group of people imagining something “non physical” in their heads

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Nobody hates themselves if they disagree with you on God

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Consider prayer being the first step. The students are able to put in to words their thoughts that they want to do well on a test. That comes from spirit, and the Spirit can prompt them to work harder for the next test. Care. Caring is a strong step forward.

96

I can relate. People begin to feel lovable when they are loved. Miss out on that love and the conclusion often is, something about my make-up, something about me, simply isn’t lovable. I flat out begged God, this being the case, He would have to remake me.

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Yes, this right here! But, it can’t be some convoluted form of external love, it has to come from within. Love thyself, or learn how to. It makes a world of difference.

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You don’t need to believe in God to love others or yourself

99

I agree.

We need to move beyond 2000+ year old ancient mythologies to understand reality.

100

Yes and no (in my own experience). We are all so unique, and we all see things from slightly different perspectives. In my case, I began with prayer. “Something is wrong with me; fix it.” What did not happen is that an hour following the prayer the fix of my own imagination did not instantly snap into place. Prayer and miracles take time, but working inwardly with prayer I learned my own imagination was much too small. I had been looking at everything as my own fault. There were other dimensions: My fault, fault elsewhere, and no one’s fault, it just worked out that way. It was a whole new way of looking at the world–spiritual expansion. The Great Spirit cared that my itsy bitsy teenie weenie malfunction mattered.

People don’t want to learn this about God–that their minuscule problems are cared about and can be tended to. Non-believers scoff that God cares about something this microscopic when He should be out ending wars, instantly curing children from cancer, and insuring no vehicle would ever crash. God, they think, should work instantly–not take years working on what they consider to be a minor problem. God once took over four years to help me with another problem I was having. God’s fault? No. He had to prepare the soil, so-to-speak, and God doesn’t come in with a bulldozer. He carefully works with His own hands, His touch so delicate it often can only be seen in hindsight.

Why doesn’t God end wars? Two answers. Nations can end what they start. I will add, eyes twinkling, God is so busy working with the small things bothering His children, He simply doesn’t have time to waste on big government entities.

If God loves us that much…we are lovable. He helps us see why we are.

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