God and the Devil


#682

It tells us that God knows that no matter what man does, His own plan will triumph.


#683

God ordained His own plan from the beginning, not any human plan. It makes no logical sense for God to put His own plan into action while at the same time setting up His own opposition to that plan. No one plans a vacation and then makes plans to insure that vacation never happens.

God ordained His own plan from the beginning. He did not ordain each individual’s. On the other hand, God readily accepts our help, even desires it. He does not mandate it. From the womb, God knew Jeremiah had qualities that would be of service to Him. Christians can point to this life in the womb as personhood being formed very early, perhaps as early as conception. Jeremiah heard God’s call for help–and heeded it. Jeremiah could also have ignored it, but it wasn’t in Jeremiah himself to ignore anyone who needed help–especially not God. Jeremiah’s character and personality was not God pulling puppet strings. It was God who gladly made use of help offered.


#684

And yet no one knows his plan. What a convenient hole filler for you. Nothing makes sense. But that’s ok. God has a “plan”.


#685

How exactly does someone know whats going to happen if they dont know all of whats going to happen?

For lack of a better way to say it, you come off as if God doesnt have a real plan, hes just winging it and hoping he set things up the right way. Doesnt sound very omniscient to me…


#686

Ask what the “plan” is. They dont know. But they’ll assert it whenever the questions get too tough.


#687

No, the words are right in front of you. He knows what is going to happen. Im pretty sure those are the actual words, not even an interpretation.


#688

Man is PART of that plan. God doesnt make mistakes, remember? If that is to be believed, then there is no possible way He didnt plan for the actions of each and every one of us.

Its as simple as the Butterfly Effect. If even one thing changes, the whole timeline changes, and what he ordained wouldnt then happen the way He planned for it.

Theres really no other way to explain it…though its fun watching you try.


#689

Imagine a nuclear war. I’m sure God didnt see that coming. He just planned for the radiation cloud. Or how about when the next super volcano in Yellowstone erupts. Whoops didnt plan fir that. Or maybe the next asteroid that hits the earth. I guess that will be our fault for living on Earth. Free will. God just had to make asteroids I guess. He loves us.


#690

I am merely noting that the Bible does not state that. Those are conclusions you have formed after reading Bible stories.


#691

Doesnt state what, exactly?


#692

Doesn’t state that God has every moment of our lives planned–or for that matter that He had a specific plan for each one of us before any of us were born.


#693

Now you are trying to have it both ways…shame on you.

The bible does state that God knows all. To claim otherwise would be being totally disingenuous. If He knows we cant destroy whatever it is that is His plan, the ONLY way that can be is if He has planned for EVERY contingency and knows what the results of every choice will be. Again, the Butterfly Effect.

Also, the bible also states that God knows who we are and what we will become from the moment of our creation. If that is the case, how can you interpret that to mean anything other than He knows everything about you?


#694

Ask how a nuclear war would effect his plan. Or a large asteroid. Then bring it back to the context of God being “love”. Its all hogwash.


#695

One of the best passages in the Bible (it is mentioned twice) is not to add or subtract from what is written.


#696

In other words, believe exactly what it says and dont ask questions. You spend a lot of time offering interpretation - adding and subtracting. Sorry, I feel like you bounce around from bible talking point to bible talking point and never directly answer anything. Case in point - this post I’m quoting. @bullseyelqcs makes a compelling argument and you essentially say to just read the bible and take it at its word. Well ok. In that case, God killed everything in the flood and is a sadistic murderer. Dont add or subtract!


#697

Stop asking questions. Just believe what the bible says.


#698

I’m glad we get to quote deuteronomy

Such a great God inspired book. Why did Christians subtract the above passages in their lives


#699

What did I add or subtract? Im not the one “interpreting” things…Im taking the words as they are absolutely written.


#700

Dont add or subtract


#701

“It is easy for a sticky hand to adhere, and hard to awaken from deep dreaming. Some people seal up a text and restrict its sense, declaring their own personal understanding of it to be right. They vie with others to seize tiles and pebbles, thinking they are baubles of lapis lazuli.”

Chih-i (Tien-t’ai the great writes in lesser Chapter 5 of the Maka Shikan:

Literal thinking alone, will never help anyone grasp religion.

Using Deuteronomy, and the “do not add or remove” quotes to slander and ridicule religion and thinking one is clever, is a living embarrasment, etched into one’s soul.

Admonitions, “do not add or remove,” appears in the Bible and some Sutras of Buddhism. It also commonly appeared in secular documents when volumes were compiled. This can be found in a number of countries, with scriptures and secular documents.

The point of trying to defeat the Bible, and to create doubts in believers to defend atheism, is creating a hell for yourself.