Federal taxes - from whom? for whom?

Phaedrus · 2018-11-03T20:34:15.055Z

As a liberal newbie here, I’ve seen a lot of rhetoric from the right that members of the caravan are invading our country for “government cheese”. I’ve seen just as much from the left that says “No, no, they’re fleeing violence and seeking to build a better, safer life.” The truth, as is always the case, lies somewhere in the middle. But it got me thinking.

I direct this serious query mostly to the right-leaning members of the forum, whose political viewpoint I think can be fairly stated as “No more taxation than is absolutely necessary.” It seems clear to me that the left/right dispute in this area revolves around “more” and “necessary”. So I ask for your opinions, focused at the 5,000-foot level:

What federal taxes should be collected?
From what entities (businesses, individuals), and in what proportion?
For which purposes?

I intend absolutely no snark here. I’m genuinely curious as to e.g. whether a business owner (or corporation) should be taxed on business income; whether environmental regulation and protection (which costs money) is a legitimate government function; whether single-payer healthcare should be OK only for senior citizens (because Medicare existed long before this question) or for all citizens (or not at all).

bootz · 2018-11-03T21:10:04.554Z

direct taxes should be apportioned equally among the states, indirect taxes should be uniform across the states. That is what the constitution provides for. until 1914 taxes were raised by tariffs, indirect taxes, and excise taxes which are also indirect taxes.

Then came the fed which needed debt to increase the money supply and then came government borrowing. With bonds as collateral or reserves the government needed to borrow as income taxes were the method to secure government debt.

Phaedrus · 2018-11-03T21:17:57.816Z

Thanks for replying. So, given today’s national and global economies, what realistic changes should be made? Apart from the simple, obvious, and highly unlikely “tax less, and spend WAY less”?

bootz · 2018-11-03T21:27:15.636Z

national and global economies existed at the founding, the question is what is a direct tax and an indirect tax?

going to concert will reply later

bootz · 2018-11-04T15:15:57.339Z

First, apply standards from the private sector to the public sector in terms of accountability and fraud. for example what happens in the private sector when you raid a pension fund?

Second transfer federal programs to the states. this allows for 50 experiments. and state to state migration.

Third, phase out the fed. then all of the sudden deficits become a problem, or just return to ma gold standard.

You will find when the government cannot easily borrow money that programs will all of the sudden become less desired.

4th, transfer as much as you can to the private sector.

whatever perils may lie in the private sector they are small in comparison to the mass fraud of government.

bootz · 2018-11-05T05:40:58.014Z

you abandoned your own thread.

Guvnah · 2018-11-05T17:29:17.432Z

Federal taxes should be collected in the amount sufficient to pay the budget.

(Currently we fall woefully short on that front.)

The amount by which collections fall short should be cut from the budget.

To me, it’s not worth the effort to figure out tax burdens and allocations and all that if we’re not even going to attempt achieving any sort of balance between revenues and expenditures.