End Gun-Free Zones

[WCD9973]

@Samm

@WCD9973

@Samm

@sikofit

@Snow96

Kind of odd you say the LIBERAL shooter had mental issues, but the conservative one didn’t.

Why is that odd? The right tries that with practically every mass shooting where the shooter has conservative political views

You are missing the point. Everyone who shoots a bunch of strangers for no rational reason (is there ever a rational reason?) has mental issues. Every mass murder of this kind (most mass shootings are drug/gang related) are committed by people with mental issues. The sooner you realize that and quit blaming guns and the NRA, the sooner the problem can be addressed.

I don’t get this arguement. I agree -Mental illness is a big part of it. When someone is suicidal - You know what they do? They remove anything they could have access to that will hurt themselves. They don’t call it a day after that -but its the first step.
Mental illness is a issue.
Easy access to guns to people who have mental illness is a big part of it as well.
Easy Access to guns that could cause a LOT of damage in a short amount of time - is a even bigger part of it.

It’s easy to say “easy access to guns,” but the truth of the matter is, access to guns today is considerably more restricted than it was even 20 years ago. And 50+ years ago, when I was a teenager, I could have bought semi-automatic hand guns from ads in gun magazines or rifles from Sears or Montgomery Ward, no questions asked. As it was, I bought my first hunting rifle at a sporting goods store at 16 without even having to show an ID. It’s not access to guns that has become easier, it’s society has become worse.

And by the way, it is illegal to sell a gun to a mentally unstable person. The problem is, there is no obvious way to determine that and the legal hurdles and professional ethics of the mental health profession make it even more difficult. That is where the problem solvers should start, not by placing even more restrictions on guns. Crazy people can still kill in large numbers without guns, but it is very difficult to stop them once they begin killing without a gun.

Yes and no. I mean -lets take your example that its already illegal to sell to a mental unstable person and we should start there. Wouldnt that mean a better, universal background check? So even if we can agree and figure a way to report who is mentally unstable - even private sellers would have to check?
And wouldn’t it make sense then that if we figured a better way to report it -that we would require all agencies to actually report it? Such as - say you were deemed to mental unstable to control your own finance? Wouldn’t we want to ensure that info is required to get reported to the instant background check?

In fact -if you were to start with “Lets enforce the rules today” wouldn’t you START with mandating that LE agencies HAVE to report all things that make you ineligible to the instant background check in say 48 hours? See -I 100% AGREE with you thats where we should start. But when we have started there to many have still stopped us there.

[WCD9973]

BTW- i’ll just ask it here because why not. I keep being told that banning assault weapon wont work because 1- We have to define assault weapons and 2- If you ban it, only criminals will have them.
For the 1st one -Do we really think we can’t define it? The state of VA tried and i think has a pretty good starting point. " [A]ny semi-automatic center-fire rifle or pistol which expels single or multiple projectiles by action of an explosion of a combustible material and is equipped at the time of the offense with a magazine which will hold more than 20 rounds of ammunition or designed by the manufacturer to accommodate a silencer or equipped with a folding stock.4"

So we took care of #1. For number 2. How many mass murders (or any) have happen in the past 20 years due to a fully automatic weapon?
I honestly don’t know and am asking.

I think the number is low. Like REALLY low. I could only find 4 shootings with fully automatic weapons since the 30’s. Is that correct?

Why would that be? Is it because they are illegal and banned? Shouldnt that mean that only criminals have them? Based on the logic i heard, that banning a weapon wont actually change the number of criminals that have it - shouldn’t criminals still have fully automatic weapons and being using them?

[Munimula1]

@Samm

@Munimula1

@Samm

@Munimula1

@Snow96

Wish there was more to the story on how the ar-15 was stored in the officers office. Was it just on the wall? was it in a gun safe? Betting it was improperly stored.

Oh I bet you are correct. But- not everyone is responsible, so incidents like this are bound to happen.

The incident was a stolen gun, not dead people. Any time valuables are left unsecured, they are vulnerable to be stolen.

According to the news reports, the two youths broke into the school at night and managed to breach a safe where the gun was kept. How they got the safe open was not indicated, but I’d bet the resource officer left the combination in an unsecured desk drawer. Regardless, this was a simple burglary … no student was ever in danger.

This time.

Do you honestly believe that this theft could have occurred during the day when the resource officer was there?

You know, don’t you, that even police have guns stolen from them when they are not looking.

Aren’t u making my case for me?

[Samm]

If the NICS background check for FFL sales don’t catch the mentally ill, how do you expect a “universal” background check to catch them? It’s not the lack of checking, it the lack of a record of their mental instability being in the data base. That’s why I say you need to start there … if they are not identified in the system, no amount of checking will weed them out for purchasing guns.

[Samm]

@WCD9973

How many mass murders (or any) have happen in the past 20 years due to a fully automatic weapon?
I honestly don’t know and am asking.

I think the number is low. Like REALLY low. I could only find 4 shootings with fully automatic weapons since the 30’s. Is that correct?

Why would that be? Is it because they are illegal and banned? Shouldnt that mean that only criminals have them? Based on the logic i heard, that banning a weapon wont actually change the number of criminals that have it - shouldn’t criminals still have fully automatic weapons and being using them?

Fully automatic weapons are not banned, they simply require a very thorough background check and a permit to own. They are not often used by criminals (except on TV and the movies) because there are few available and they are expensive to acquire and expensive to feed. If the same was done with semi-auto guns, first off, they are here in great numbers so would be very difficult to remove, especially from the illicit market, and even if you were successful at eliminating say 90% of them, mass killers would not be dissuaded, as there are many options. In fact, up until just a few years ago, it was extremely rare for a mass shooter to use a semi-auto rifle. Eliminating them would do nothing to stop pathological minds from carrying out their acts. It’s time people quit focusing on an object and began seeing the actual cause of mass shootings.

[Samm]

@Munimula1

@Samm

@Munimula1

@Samm

@Munimula1

@Snow96

Wish there was more to the story on how the ar-15 was stored in the officers office. Was it just on the wall? was it in a gun safe? Betting it was improperly stored.

Oh I bet you are correct. But- not everyone is responsible, so incidents like this are bound to happen.

The incident was a stolen gun, not dead people. Any time valuables are left unsecured, they are vulnerable to be stolen.

According to the news reports, the two youths broke into the school at night and managed to breach a safe where the gun was kept. How they got the safe open was not indicated, but I’d bet the resource officer left the combination in an unsecured desk drawer. Regardless, this was a simple burglary … no student was ever in danger.

This time.

Do you honestly believe that this theft could have occurred during the day when the resource officer was there?

You know, don’t you, that even police have guns stolen from them when they are not looking.

Aren’t u making my case for me?

No.

…

[Weedhopper]

That’s only at the gun stores Obamguns were sold to Drug Cartels.

RIP Agent Brian terry.

[TommyLucchese]

@WuWei

I would have said horse ■■■■■

Except the three most common ways criminals in America get guns is through straw buyers, people who buy guns and then pretend to have their house burglarized and ones that are actually burglarized.

[Samm]

No its not. Most criminals buy their guns from other criminals. Straw buyers are relatively rare, and pretending to have the house burglarized is even more rare. Most guns reach the criminals by being stolen from folks like you and me and/or at merchant level.

[WCD9973]

60% of all guns used in crimes according to the DEA were purchased legally in the US.
That doesn’t seem to be “only a few”

[WuWei]

@WCD9973

60% of all guns used in crimes according to the DEA were purchased legally in the US.
That doesn’t seem to be “only a few”

The DEA? They can’t find their collective asses with both hands. What do Crockett and Tubbs say?

[WCD9973]

See what you did there? Fully automatic weapons “require a very thorough background check and a permit” and are expensive.
Prob cause they are hard to get…

See what Im getting at?? Permit, thorough background check, expensive. Sounds good to me for assault weapons!
Yes, lot of assault rifles are out there now, but if we stop selling them today, what would it be like in 5 years? 10 years? 25 years?
As for weren’t used before, they were, but less. Because they were made as much

[WuWei]

@WCD9973

See what you did there? Fully automatic weapons “require a very thorough background check and a permit” and are expensive.
Prob cause they are hard to get…

See what Im getting at?? Permit, thorough background check, expensive. Sounds good to me for assault weapons!
Yes, lot of assault rifles are out there now, but if we stop selling them today, what would it be like in 5 years? 10 years? 25 years?
As for weren’t used before, they were, but less. Because they were made as much

Guns don’t expire.

[WCD9973]

Sorry. ATF. Will find the link.

[WCD9973]

Guns don’t expire but ones owned by bad guys tended to be taken, ditched, destroyed, etc…
You don’t see many “Tommy guns” being used by gangs today do you

[CanadianJudo]

for some reason I have a hard time believing a Wall-Mart in Texas was a gun free zone.

[WuWei]

@WCD9973

Sorry. ATF. Will find the link.

Don’t bother, I won’t read the tripe. The ATF should be disbanded so hard Google can’t find it.

■■■■ the ATF.

[WuWei]

@WCD9973

Guns don’t expire but ones owned by bad guys tended to be taken, ditched, destroyed, etc…
You don’t see many “Tommy guns” being used by gangs today do you

I like you. You’re all right. Have you ever touched a gun?

[WCD9973]

Yup. I have but not something I do regularly.
In fairness, I’ve never been President but still have views on those that have

[WuWei]

@WCD9973

Yup. I have but not something I do regularly.
In fairness, I’ve never been President but still have views on those that have

That’s not in fairness, but it’s ok. I was just wondering. You’re very enthusiastic and that counts.