Denmark's free college has created "eternity students" who never graduate

Liberty323 · 2021-03-18T16:08:27.728Z

Jezcoe:

Samm:

Jezcoe:

And I am talking about how costs have risen out of control and the value of the education itself.

But that goes back to your response about “useless degrees” which is what I was talking about.

To which I am arguing that the idea that a degree is “useless” is subjective.

Should a degree be wildly expensive?

I don’t see why it should be.

I’m in total agreement with you. I got out of school in '96 before prices skyrocketed. I think the schools began raising their prices for degrees simply because they could. With student loans available to anybody the colleges knew they would get their money whether the students found lucrative employment or not. If someone wants to get a LA degree because they love the subject, fine, but don’t make them have to mortgage their future for it. This is why I think colleges are just a racket these days.
If they were only $20,000 in the hole after graduating with a LA degree that wouldn’t be so bad, but having to pay 6 figures back in loans is ridiculous. I think schools should charge based on the employability forecasts for the majors. A philosophy degree should not be as expensive as a nuclear engineering degree.

zantax · 2021-03-18T16:15:53.033Z

Prices in 96 for state schools was 11k, rounded, now 20k also rounded, doesn’t seem extreme to me for it to double over twenty years. What did a car cost back then? How about a house?

zantax · 2021-03-18T16:17:49.572Z

By the way, it’s a lot cheaper if you pay when your kid is born, costs you a fraction of the price if you let
market gains accumulate for 18 years.

Liberty323 · 2021-03-18T16:23:19.314Z

Well then it must be the room, meals, and books that have quadrupled because prices are insane now. Where I went we had to live on campus our first year regardless of age or grade. I was a junior. When I graduated I only owed about $12,000 total which I paid off in about 5 years. Now, kids I know who go to the same school are owing about 80k after graduation. It’s coming from somewhere.
Something that made a HUGE difference for me was going to a local community college my freshman and sophomore years. They were completely paid for before transferring to the 4 year university.

zantax · 2021-03-18T16:27:42.435Z

Liberty323:

Well then it must be the room, meals, and books that have quadrupled because prices are insane now. Where I went we had to live on campus our first year regardless of age or grade. I was a junior. When I graduated I only owed about $12,000 total which I paid off in about 5 years. Now, kids I know who go to the same school are owing about 80k after graduation. It’s coming from somewhere.
Something that made a HUGE difference for me was going to a local community college my freshman and sophomore years. They were completely paid for before transferring to the 4 year university.

Then don’t compare what you paid to four years of living on campus. And those prices were tuition, fees and room and board.

nces.ed.gov

Fast Facts: Tuition costs of colleges and universities (76)

The NCES Fast Facts Tool provides quick answers to many education questions (National Center for Education Statistics). Get answers on Early Childhood Education, Elementary and Secondary Education and Higher Education here.

The real explosion in cost are top tier and private schools, not state colleges unless it’s an ivy. And that is due to demand. Lot more people going to college these days.

Liberty323 · 2021-03-18T16:49:14.100Z

But don’t you think the easier availability to student loans has helped to drive the demand? I remember when prospective students actually had to face a little scrutiny to qualify for student loans. Now all you have to have is a hs diploma.

zantax · 2021-03-18T16:57:27.208Z

Liberty323:

But don’t you think the easier availability to student loans has helped to drive the demand? I remember when prospective students actually had to face a little scrutiny to qualify for student loans. Now all you have to have is a hs diploma.

Sure but mostly at the private college level, state school prices are regulated. And still a good bargain if you ask me, more so if you do the first two years at community college. Not very far out of line from what I paid in the early nineties when adjusted for inflation. Ivy and private though, through the roof.

Jezcoe · 2021-03-18T17:19:05.473Z

Liberty323:

Well then it must be the room, meals, and books that have quadrupled because prices are insane now. Where I went we had to live on campus our first year regardless of age or grade. I was a junior. When I graduated I only owed about $12,000 total which I paid off in about 5 years. Now, kids I know who go to the same school are owing about 80k after graduation. It’s coming from somewhere.
Something that made a HUGE difference for me was going to a local community college my freshman and sophomore years. They were completely paid for before transferring to the 4 year university.

I looked up my alma mater. Price per credit hour has quadrupled since I went there and it is a State school.

zantax · 2021-03-18T17:20:06.513Z

Jezcoe:

Liberty323:

Well then it must be the room, meals, and books that have quadrupled because prices are insane now. Where I went we had to live on campus our first year regardless of age or grade. I was a junior. When I graduated I only owed about $12,000 total which I paid off in about 5 years. Now, kids I know who go to the same school are owing about 80k after graduation. It’s coming from somewhere.
Something that made a HUGE difference for me was going to a local community college my freshman and sophomore years. They were completely paid for before transferring to the 4 year university.

I looked up my alma mater. Price per credit hour has quadrupled since I went there and it is a State school.

Let me guess, Penn?

Jezcoe · 2021-03-18T17:20:34.092Z

zantax:

Jezcoe:

Liberty323:

Well then it must be the room, meals, and books that have quadrupled because prices are insane now. Where I went we had to live on campus our first year regardless of age or grade. I was a junior. When I graduated I only owed about $12,000 total which I paid off in about 5 years. Now, kids I know who go to the same school are owing about 80k after graduation. It’s coming from somewhere.
Something that made a HUGE difference for me was going to a local community college my freshman and sophomore years. They were completely paid for before transferring to the 4 year university.

I looked up my alma mater. Price per credit hour has quadrupled since I went there and it is a State school.

Let me guess, Penn?

Nope.

zantax · 2021-03-18T17:21:11.231Z

Public ivy though, right?

Jezcoe · 2021-03-18T17:24:23.544Z

zantax:

Public ivy though, right?

Nope. State school.

zantax · 2021-03-18T17:28:41.755Z

Jezcoe:

zantax:

Public ivy though, right?

Nope. State school.

Then you are old or an anomaly.

Jezcoe · 2021-03-18T17:32:12.420Z

zantax:

Jezcoe:

zantax:

Public ivy though, right?

Nope. State school.

Then you are old or an anomaly.

Nope. Not really either.

zantax · 2021-03-18T17:34:14.207Z

Jezcoe:

zantax:

Jezcoe:

zantax:

Public ivy though, right?

Nope. State school.

Then you are old or an anomaly.

Nope. Not really either.

Well you could just say which school, shouldn’t be any chance of identifying you. I’ll go first, University of Delaware.

Samm · 2021-03-18T21:18:07.125Z

Liberty323:

Jezcoe:

Samm:

Jezcoe:

And I am talking about how costs have risen out of control and the value of the education itself.

But that goes back to your response about “useless degrees” which is what I was talking about.

To which I am arguing that the idea that a degree is “useless” is subjective.

Should a degree be wildly expensive?

I don’t see why it should be.

I’m in total agreement with you. I got out of school in '96 before prices skyrocketed. I think the schools began raising their prices for degrees simply because they could. With student loans available to anybody the colleges knew they would get their money whether the students found lucrative employment or not. If someone wants to get a LA degree because they love the subject, fine, but don’t make them have to mortgage their future for it. This is why I think colleges are just a racket these days.
If they were only $20,000 in the hole after graduating with a LA degree that wouldn’t be so bad, but having to pay 6 figures back in loans is ridiculous. I think schools should charge based on the employability forecasts for the majors. A philosophy degree should not be as expensive as a nuclear engineering degree.

You are right. With the advent of easy loans and grants, it was inevitable that Universities would increase their prices to suck up as much of that money as possible.

Eagle-Keeper · 2021-03-18T21:25:00.817Z

zantax:

Prices in 96 for state schools was 11k, rounded, now 20k also rounded, doesn’t seem extreme to me for it to double over twenty years. What did a car cost back then? How about a house?

There’s no way your numbers can be accurate. I graduated in 96 at a state school and the cost of my four year degree was around $11,000. Today one year is around $15,000.

Eagle-Keeper · 2021-03-18T21:41:09.010Z

Liberty323:

I think the schools began raising their prices for degrees simply because they could. With student loans available to anybody the colleges knew they would get their money whether the students found lucrative employment or not.

There’s another thread with different links discussing the various reasons costs went up. One of the things that happened starting around the late 1980’s, was that a college degree became a requirement to get an interview for a so-called white collar job. Part of the problem is that the consumer (students and parents) basically said that they were willing to pay anything for that piece of paper.

zantax · 2021-03-19T01:08:23.302Z

Eagle-Keeper:

zantax:

Prices in 96 for state schools was 11k, rounded, now 20k also rounded, doesn’t seem extreme to me for it to double over twenty years. What did a car cost back then? How about a house?

There’s no way your numbers can be accurate. I graduated in 96 at a state school and the cost of my four year degree was around $11,000. Today one year is around $15,000.

I linked my source.

Yossarian · 2021-03-19T15:12:23.276Z

TommyLucchese:

Eagle-Keeper:

What was the point of you saying that you have a degree in Theater and make over $100,000?

More than you realize apparently lol. Most techs for theater/TV/movies are unionized and make decent money.

Not so much for theater techs outside of Broadway, Touring Shows (and the theaters they play in), and Arenas. There are around a hundred “Regional” Theaters around the country - the ones that run a season of shows from Sept - May, as well as Summer theaters. Although by contract, they need to hire a number of Union actors, stage managers and designers; the techs (carpenters/stage/lighting) are usually not union.

At least that was how it was when I was a theater tech up to 25 years ago. Although I worked in the scene shop for many regional theatres (non-union), I was also a member of IATSE and regularly worked road shows, events and concerts.