The test comes down to whether the baker would make an identically designed cake for a non-gender-transition reason, but refuses when it’s purpose is for a gender-transition celebration.
If i’m refusing the same exact design of tattoo because the customer is black, that’s discrimination. If i refuse a different designed tattoo to a black man, that’s not discrimination.
That has already been addressed in this thread.
Quite poorly. I was there. The people that made that argument got whupped.
Here’s what the baker said:
“I serve all customers,” Phillips said once again in his formal statement. “I simply decline to create custom cakes that express messages or celebrate events in violation of my deeply held beliefs.”
He said so himself. It doesn’t matter what the cake looks like. He doesn’t like the ceremony it’s being used for. So this is not about his “artistry.”
Yes, there was obviously something about the design he felt made it a transgender celebration cake or he would have just asked for a cake. And yes, creating a cake is art. It may not always be complex art but it is art. A drawing or painting can be simple and even routine and common place but it is still art.
from Art Definition & Meaning - Merriam-Webster
4 the conscious use of skill and creative imagination especially in the production of aesthetic objects
- the art of painting landscapes
; also : works so produced
- a gallery for modern art
Aesthetics are a main component in cakes. They require skill and creativity to create, custom ones anyway. The best bakers have a reputation for aesthetics to uphold, it is what sets them apart from lower paid people who can bake good tasting ugly cakes. Look at his website, he holds himself out as a talented artist who makes custom cakes, not a mere baker.
Not the design.
He rejected the request – no matter what the design would have been – because of what it represented.
…
First of all, he probably wouldn’t ask the purpose. We know that the transgender cake was requested with the purpose stated right up front.
But he would gladly create the yellow and red cake for another reason that isn’t offensive.
It has nothing to do with the design, and everything to do with the meaning of the request.
Don’t ask, don’t tell. Get your cake and go to your holocaust party.
Why does this keep coming up? It’s not a factor in this baker’s case. (Nor the first case that the SCOTUS ruled against.)
Get it right Calvin.
He’s not discriminating against their gender identity.
He’s discriminating against their desire to celebrate their gender identity.
Celebrations are not covered under PA laws.
The request.
The plaintiff made a distinction. It shouldn’t fall to the baker to know what every possible design means. If you ask the tattoo artist to give you three curly lines that represent white supremacy, he is under no obligation to know if that actually represents it to anyone other than you to refuse it. Your stated purpose for the use of his work is sufficient.
For a transgender change celebration? That was the explicit reason given, after all.
But hey, I encourage you to find a black tattoo artist doing custom tattoo’s and go in and ask him to give you a tattoo consisting of some squiggly lines that you claim represents whites superiority over black people and see if he submits to your request.
Asked and answered 100 times.
To eat. The customer wanted to eat the cake. That’s what most people do with cakes, right?
I know. The answer is “it isn’t”.
I just want to look at my white supremacy tattoo, that’s what people do with tattoo’s right? Please ignore that I told the black tattoo artist it was a celebration of white supremacy.
White supremacy isn’t a protected class.
Your analogy only works if I tell the tattoo artist that the squiggly lines represent Christianity.
They’re sticking with this lie.
Calirepub has been directly corrected on this. He knows it’s dishonest. He’ll keep asking it though.
The next time you make an analogy, try to keep it within the realm of protected classes. Like maybe the squiggly lines represent their physical handicap.
Err no, false. As I have been over and over, protected class isn’t a special status granting special on demand artwork. If a black tattoo artist can refuse to give you a tattoo because he has a moral objection to your stated meaning of the tattoo in question, it follows a protected class can be denied for the same reason. You may as well say being in a protected class means the vegan restaurant has to serve you a steak because you are in a protected class.
