Capitalism vs Socialism - America's Choice


#164

I recall you saying the Nordics were actually free market, but even if you did not, there are plenty other examples of this sort of flip flopping from conservatives on the matter of the Scandinavian countries.


#165

And that is why our founders rejected a “democracy” [a mob rule system of government] and created a constitutionally limited “Republican Form of Government” guaranteed under Article 4, Section 4 of our Constitution.

And just what did our Founding Fathers think of “democracy”? Madison, in Federalist No. 10 says in reference to “democracy” they

“…have ever been found incompatible with personal security or the rights of property; and have in general been as short in their lives as they have been violent in their deaths. Theoretic politicians, who have patronized this species of government, have erroneously supposed that by reducing mankind to a perfect equality in their political rights, they would, at the same time, be perfectly equalized and assimilated in their possessions, their opinions, and their passions.”

And during the Convention which framed our federal Constitution, Elbridge Gerry and Roger Sherman, delegates from Massachusetts and Connecticut, urged the Convention to create a system which would eliminate "the evils we experience," saying that those "evils . . .flow from the excess of democracy…"

And, then there was John Adams, a principle force in the American Revolutionary period who also pointed out "democracy will envy all, contend with all, endeavor to pull down all; and when by chance it happens to get the upper hand for a short time, it will be revengeful, bloody, and cruel…"

And Samuel Adams, a signer of the Declaration of Independence and favoring the new Constitution as opposed to democracy declared: "Democracy never lasts long” . . . "It soon wastes, exhausts and murders itself.". . . "There was never a democracy that ‘did not commit suicide.’"

And during the Constitutional Convention, Hamilton stated: "We are a Republican Government. Real liberty is never found in despotism or in the extremes of Democracy."

And then there was Benjamin Franklin, who informed a crowd when exiting the Convention as to what system of government they created, he responded by saying "A republic, if you can keep it."

Democracy, or majority rule vote, as the Founding Fathers well knew, whether that majority rule is practiced by the people or by elected representatives, if not restrained by specific limitations and particular guarantees in which the unalienable rights of mankind are put beyond the reach of political majorities, have proven throughout history to eventually result in nothing less than an unbridled mob rule system susceptible to the wants and passions of a political majority imposing its will upon those who may be outvoted, and would result in the subjugation of unalienable rights, and especially rights associated with property ownership and liberty [witness the recent Kelo case]. And so, our Founding Fathers gave us a constitutionally limited Republican Form of Government, guaranteed by Article 4, Section 4 of the Constitution of the United States.

JWK

The Bernie Sanders and Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez’s socialism will promise food on the table, free public housing, health care for all, guaranteed income, free college tuition, and other niceties by taxing the so called rich; and if by chance their socialist leadership gains control because of such promises made, the end result, as John Adams stated, “will be revengeful, bloody, and cruel” especially for the most productive, hardworking members of the community.


#166

We have a democratic republic.


#167

But not a “democracy”!

In fact, our Constitution declares:

The United States shall guarantee to every State in this Union a Republican Form of Government, and shall protect each of them against Invasion; and on Application of the Legislature, or of the Executive (when the Legislature cannot be convened) against domestic Violence.

JWK

It was March of 2019 when an ongoing invasion of America’s borders swelled to tens of thousands a month, not a shot was fired to defend the borders of the United States, and America’s domestic enemies ___ socialists, communists and anarchists in Congress ___ continued with their obstruction against securing America’s borders and refused to pass laws allowing an immediate repatriation of undesirable foreigners who are invading America’s borders.


#168

We vote for potus, congress, and various other things. DEMOCRACY!


#169

We do not vote to pass federal legislation. Those we elect do that and constitutes A REPUBLICAN FORM OF GOVERNMENT

JWK

Democracy is best described as three wolves and a sheep voting for dinners menu.


#170

We vote for potus, congress, and various other things. DEMOCRACY!


#171

We do not vote directly to enact legislation, which is a key feature a democracy. We vote for representatives who then enact legislation within the four corners of a written constitution. And our Constitution guarantees, by Article 4, Section 4, a “Republican Form of Government”, not a democracy.

Are you a victim of a government school education?

JWK

During the Convention which framed our federal Constitution, Elbridge Gerry and Roger Sherman, delegates from Massachusetts and Connecticut, urged the Convention to create a system which would eliminate “the evils we experience,” saying that those "evils . . .flow from the excess of democracy…"


#172

We are a democratic republic.

From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

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A democratic republic is a form of government operating on principles adopted from a republic and a democracy. Rather than being a cross between two entirely separate systems, democratic republics may function on principles shared by both republics and democracies.


#173

From the Constitution of the United States:

“The United States shall guarantee to every State in this Union a Republican Form of Government, and shall protect each of them against Invasion; and on Application of the Legislature, or of the Executive (when the Legislature cannot be convened) against domestic Violence.”

JWK

It was March of 2019 when an ongoing invasion of America’s borders swelled to tens of thousands a month, not a shot was fired to defend the borders of the United States, and America’s domestic enemies ___ socialists, communists and anarchists in Congress ___ continued with their obstruction against securing America’s borders and refused to pass laws allowing an immediate repatriation of undesirable foreigners who are invading America’s borders.


#174

Pet peeve—can you people please just freaking highlight the most recent reply in a reply chain to quote that rather than the whole effing chain? Quit being lazy and help everyone save some scrolls.


#175

THis is an interesting article on the Gymboree bankruptcy.

10,000 workers out of work across the country. Executives with ailing parents get no severance plan…but the “high up” guys - they get their golden parachutes and will doubtless be hired onto the Board of Directors of other companies - despite that fact that they drove their own company into the ground.

If workers distrust capitalism - or what they see as capitalism - it’s events like this that probably spur it on.


#176

Yep a DEMOCRATIC republic.


#177

But not a democracy.

In fact, our Constitution declares:

“The United States shall guarantee to every State in this Union a Republican Form of Government, and shall protect each of them against Invasion; and on Application of the Legislature, or of the Executive (when the Legislature cannot be convened) against domestic Violence.”

JWK

It was March of 2019 when an ongoing invasion of America’s borders swelled to tens of thousands a month, not a shot was fired to defend the borders of the United States, and America’s domestic enemies ___ socialists, communists and anarchists in Congress ___ continued with their obstruction against securing America’s borders and refused to pass laws allowing an immediate repatriation of undesirable foreigners who are invading America’s borders.


#178

The fact that its democratic means DEMOCRACY!


#179

And to protect against the vile extremes of “DEMOCRACY”, our founders guaranteed us a “Republican Form of Government”.

JWK

"We are a Republican Government. Real liberty is never found in despotism or in the extremes of Democracy." __ Hamilton


#180

The fact that its democratic means DEMOCRACY!


#181

Only in your mind. In fact our founders recoiled from “DEMOCRACY”. Madison, in Federalist No. 10 says in reference to “democracy” they

“…have ever been found incompatible with personal security or the rights of property; and have in general been as short in their lives as they have been violent in their deaths. Theoretic politicians, who have patronized this species of government, have erroneously supposed that by reducing mankind to a perfect equality in their political rights, they would, at the same time, be perfectly equalized and assimilated in their possessions, their opinions, and their passions.”

And during the Convention which framed our federal Constitution, Elbridge Gerry and Roger Sherman, delegates from Massachusetts and Connecticut, urged the Convention to create a system which would eliminate “the evils we experience,” saying that those “evils . . .flow from the excess of democracy…”

And, then there was John Adams, a principle force in the American Revolutionary period who also pointed out “democracy will envy all, contend with all, endeavor to pull down all; and when by chance it happens to get the upper hand for a short time, it will be revengeful, bloody, and cruel…”

And Samuel Adams, a signer of the Declaration of Independence and favoring the new Constitution as opposed to democracy declared: "Democracy never lasts long” . . . “It soon wastes, exhausts and murders itself.”. . . “There was never a democracy that ‘did not commit suicide.’”

And during the Constitutional Convention, Hamilton stated: “We are a Republican Government. Real liberty is never found in despotism or in the extremes of Democracy.”

And then there was Benjamin Franklin, who informed a crowd when exiting the Convention as to what system of government they created, he responded by saying “A republic, if you can keep it.”

Democracy, or majority rule vote, as the Founding Fathers well knew, whether that majority rule is practiced by the people or by elected representatives, if not restrained by specific limitations and particular guarantees in which the unalienable rights of mankind are put beyond the reach of political majorities, have proven throughout history to eventually result in nothing less than an unbridled mob rule system susceptible to the wants and passions of a political majority imposing its will upon those who may be outvoted, and would result in the subjugation of unalienable rights, and especially rights associated with property ownership and liberty [witness the recent Kelo case]. And so, our Founding Fathers gave us a constitutionally limited Republican Form of Government, guaranteed by Article 4, Section 4 of the Constitution of the United States.

JWK

The Bernie Sanders and Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez’s democratic socialism will promise food on the table, free public housing, health care for all, guaranteed income, free college tuition, and other niceties by taxing the so called rich; and if by chance their socialist leadership gains control because of such promises made, the end result, as John Adams stated, “will be revengeful, bloody, and cruel” especially for the most productive, hardworking members of the community.


#182

de·moc·ra·cy

/dəˈmäkrəsē/

noun

  1. a system of government by the whole population or all the eligible members of a state, typically through elected representatives.

That should put this to bed.


#183

No it isn’t. That’s just silly.