Can we beat China - economically or militarily?

The NBA just “caved” to China. NBA Backs BEIJING? Pro-Hong Kong Signs Confiscated from Fans… in Washington, DC | Sean Hannity (No mention on Hannity’s front page of the Kurd tragedy, but his website is covering this…)

Apple has also caved to China. https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/video/apple-caves-to-chinese-pressure-removes-app-allowing-hong-kong-protesters-to-track-police/vi-AAIzOsV

How is Trump’s diplomacy with China coming along?

All of Trumps foreign policy is an abject failure.

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Probably not economically as long as humans want all the money they can get. The Chinese (and then the Indian) customer will become more important than the American customer in my lifetime.

The desperate attempts to ■■■■■ foot around big issues show where many of these companies are really at. It’s easy to pretend to be socially progressive when it doesn’t really cost you anything. But when it really matters, there are very few companies that will choose morality over money.

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Sadly true.

What is your goal? America has been unique among nations because of its moral position as the exemplar of Democratic values. Our wealth and strength were allied to that, any other country could generate money or military. If we wasn’t to beat China — go for weakness which is so clearly on display in Hong Kong… but you cannot do that if every issue in the world is seen as a financial transaction.

Did you see Trey Parker of South Parks apology to China, when they were banned from China the other day it was great.

“Like the NBA, we welcome the Chinese censors into our homes and into our hearts. We too love money more than freedom and democracy. Xi doesn’t look just like Winnie the Pooh at all. Tune into our 300th episode this Wednesday at 10! Long live the Great Communist Party of China! May this autumn’s sorghum harvest be bountiful! We good now China?"

Militarily, unlikely, since we would almost certainly be fighting such a war in China’s back yard where the advantages would all be theirs.

We might yank their chain with so called “freedom of navigation” patrols, but when push comes to shove, we will avoid any sort of conventional war with China.

Do you mean what is “our” goal as in, “what is the US’s goal in the world today?”

Or do you mean what is my goal in starting the thread?

I guess my question is - even if Trump’s trade war works and China makes concessions, will the US still remain the #1 economy in the world or is that going to get ceded to China because we just can’t compete with them in that regard?

Do we need to?

I meant what the goals of the United States ought to be. If we compete with China on their terms, they are likely to surpass us economically, because a dictatorship like China that can freely impose hardship on its people will outlast us in a trade war where the US electorate will reject hardship.

But if we stand for freedom and respect of all peoples then the Chinese people will come to see us as their better alternative That worked in Eastern Europe but our leadership has gotten so focused on personal gain they’ve lost all notions of American Exceptionalism.

World leadership comes with costs… perhaps Americans no longer think those costs are worth bearing?

Depends.

I think the US and China need to take a long look at our relationship and decide which road we are going to take. We can either be friendly competitors and help maintain world peace together or we can be adversaries and have a second Cold War.

I’m hoping for friendly competition in the long run.

Well, I hate to think of the US being second best in anything. Economically, militarily, educationally, health-wise, etc.

If China starts calling the world’s tune economically, which is what we used to do, they will soon be the world’s only super power.

I hope the same, and I especially hope we never find out who would win a war, cold or hot.

With their population and single-party government I’m not sure it’s possible to stay ahead of them economically.

It don’t always work when the country (China) locks away millions of people that don’t agree with them in relearning facilities and concentration camps. At the same time they are cooking their planet with emissions and new coal plants 300 being built as they continue to grow.

It would certainly be a good idea to stop that…but how can we - or how can any other country concerned with the environment?

It worked with the Soviet Union, which locked away millions in labor camps. I’m open if you have a better suggestion… What I remember fondly was the intensity with which people in Eastern Europe during the Cold War yearned to see American values spread to their homelands… are we a country that still inspires that yearning?

How did the west handle communist Soviet Union and North Korea in terms of trade?

The west helped break the Soviet Union, whereas with China the west has made them rich by giving all our manufacturing to them. The party will run out it’s already starting to with the shrinking middle class.