In Utah, where teachers are allowed to carry firearms on school grounds with a conceal carry permit, one such teacher prevented the kidnapping of an 11 year old. 41 year old Ira Cox-Berry was apparently high on something, grabbed an 11 year old girl by the arm and was confronted by the teacher. He let the girl go, then attempted to smash out a window with his bare hands, at which point, the armed teacher produced his firearm and held the assailant at bay until police arrived.
The teacher showed restraint drawing his weapon at the point where Cox-Berry began exhibiting violent behavior.
This is one instance showing that teachers can and should be allowed to arm themselves in a school setting for their protection and the protection of others.
Who was supervising these kids in-person during recess?
Were the kids just playing outside with the only supervision being a teacher watching through a window from the inside? If that were the case, this is a pretty major problem.
The question was, if the perp were to try to leave, would the gun owner be covered.
Utah Statue says: 77-7-7. Force in making arrest.
If a person is being arrested and flees or forcibly resists after being informed of the intention to make the arrest, the person arresting may use reasonable force to effect the arrest. Deadly force may be used only as provided in Section 76-2-404.
Utah Statute 76-2-404. Law enforcement officer use of deadly force.
(1) As used in this section:
(a) “Deadly force” means force that creates or is likely to create, or that the individual using the force intends to create, a substantial likelihood of death or serious bodily injury to an individual.
(b) “Officer” means an officer described in Section 53-13-102.
(c) “Serious bodily injury” means the same as that term is defined in Section 76-1-601.
(2) The defense of justification applies to the use of deadly force by an officer, or an individual acting by the officer’s command in providing aid and assistance, when:
(a) the officer is acting in obedience to and in accordance with the judgment of a competent court in executing a penalty of death under Subsection 77-18-5.5(2), (3), or (4);
(b) effecting an arrest or preventing an escape from custody following an arrest, if:
(i) the officer reasonably believes that deadly force is necessary to prevent the arrest from being defeated by escape; and
(ii)
(A) the officer has probable cause to believe that the suspect has committed a felony offense involving the infliction or threatened infliction of death or serious bodily injury; or
(B) the officer has probable cause to believe the suspect poses a threat of death or serious bodily injury to the officer or to an individual other than the suspect if apprehension is delayed; or
(c) the officer reasonably believes that the use of deadly force is necessary to prevent death or serious bodily injury to the officer or an individual other than the suspect.
(3) If feasible, a verbal warning should be given by the officer prior to any use of deadly force under Subsection (2)(b) or (2)(c).
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Hence my question. The arrest statute says that deadly force CAN ONLY be used in accordance with 76-2-404. 76-2-404 specifically defines the use of deadly force for Law Enforcement officials. A teacher making a citizens arrest would not fall under that statute. So the gun owner, if they had shot the perp while defending themselves or the student - covered. Shooting the perp attempting to flee since if they were attempting to flee would not fall under the self-defense or defense of others qualifier.
(Disclaimer: Personally I don’t have a problem with an attempted child kidnapper getting shot. This is more a mental exercise to see what the after action outcomes would be.)
Thank you. That was my thought as well. An attempt at physical restraint? Sure, I’d help. However if the gun owner shot the perp attempting to flee it could get messy for use of deadly force when no lethal threat was still present.
If I was on the jury though, I don’t think I could vote to convict given the limited knowledge of the circumstances presented in the OP.
These questions indicate a shortcoming in our current societal psyche. We give perps too much latitude. Cops are ordered to stand back during riots. San Fran did Prop-47. (The $950 thing.) Make-my-day shootings have to be IN your house, and won’t cover you if they are breaking into an out building or your car. And here, a child abductor might be allowed to run off if he drops the kid.
I’d say that if the guy had tried to flee and the school employee shot him in the foot (thus, not even a mortal wound – kind of like Biden and other libs suggest that cops should be doing), the employee would likely face assault charges. The guy would have done society a favor by stopping him from fleeing, but would find himself on the wrong side of the law.
: Just watching and waiting!