the distress these kids have is not due to bullying, or lack of acceptance. not sure what the point is of many of your other sentence fragments.
proof of what? theres plenty of proof that gender conflicted kids are in despair and much more suicidal than non gender conflicted kids
please either legitimately join the discussion or elaborate on your sideline heckling.
ah i see your trick here. you post proof of my claim, then ask me to “prove it” as though this is your claim
you’re pulling all the stops
yes heres an example showing how high the suicide rates are

fallenturtle:
Logic would dictate that the side preaching a negative message is more likely the cause of death than the side preaching a positive message. There’s a correlation that can be viewed with gays/lesbians. Those suicides are generally not because they are gay, but because they aren’t accepted for being gay, are rejected by their family, mock by their peers.
Where’s the evidence that its the left’s message leading to suicides and not the right’s message of shame and internal suppression?
no logic does not show that
kids are distressed and conflicted over their gender identities. adding more confusion will just make that worse. thats the lefts idiotic stance - make gender determination a psychosocial construct
thats my position. if you disagree fine. if you dont prove me wrong

fallenturtle:
We already use they and them as singular pronouns in everyday English. Examples:
“Somebody left their umbrella in the office. Could you please let them know where they can get it?”
"The patient should be told at the outset how much they will be required to pay.?
“But a journalist should not be forced to reveal their sources.”
It is used to refer to other animals and inanimate objects and thus its considered dehumanizing.
They and their can be used for inanimate objects and animals as well, though. So can he and she.
The male bear walks to his cave.
The bear knows how much food they need for the winter.
The animal left their dung on the forest floor.
Agreed that they and their can be singular, but the word “it” isn’t any less dehumanizing than any other pronoun.
Heck, I am learning German and inanimate objects are always assigned either masculine, feminine or neutral genders.
Der Zeitungen is a newspaper (M)
Die Tasche is a purse (F)
Das geld is money (N)
Die, Der and Das are all the word “the”, but they change based on the gender of the object they are associated with.
The word “a” can be ein (M), eine (F), einen (plural), or ein (N).
It’s only English that doesn’t assign gender to objects, Spanish does as well and its even more ornate a system.

thinkingman:
ah i see your trick here. you post proof of my claim, then ask me to “prove it” as though this is your claim
you’re pulling all the stops
yes heres an example showing how high the suicide rates are
Did you not read these stats?
- LGB youth who come from highly rejecting families are 8.4 times as likely to have attempted suicide as LGB peers who reported no or low levels of family rejection.
- Each episode of LGBT victimization, such as physical or verbal harassment or abuse, increases the likelihood of self-harming behavior by 2.5 times on average.
We’re not arguing if they have higher suicide rates, I never claimed they didn’t… the argument is which side’s message contributes to these rates.
Perhaps I’m wrong, but your argument seems to be that its not the harassment and rejection that increases the rates of suicide but instead the recognition, acceptance, and transitioning as recommended by psychiatric professionals that leads to increased suicide among these youth. Is this an inaccurate description of your stance?

thinkingman:

fallenturtle:
Logic would dictate that the side preaching a negative message is more likely the cause of death than the side preaching a positive message. There’s a correlation that can be viewed with gays/lesbians. Those suicides are generally not because they are gay, but because they aren’t accepted for being gay, are rejected by their family, mock by their peers.
Where’s the evidence that its the left’s message leading to suicides and not the right’s message of shame and internal suppression?
no logic does not show that
kids are distressed and conflicted over their gender identities. adding more confusion will just make that worse. thats the lefts idiotic stance - make gender determination a psychosocial construct
thats my position. if you disagree fine. if you dont prove me wrong
I’ve already posted evidence that negative attitudes towards transgender people contributes to greater rates of self-harm and suicide. You have let to provide evidence of the contrary.
Here’s a well cited wikipedia article: Suicide among LGBT youth - Wikipedia
you rearranged the argument for your own benefit. i maintain that the despair of gender conflicted youth is not due to outside bullying, pressure… it may be worsened by it i will concede that, but it is not the cause
the left encourages kids to be even more gender conflicted with their attitudes toward gender fluidity, spectrum, letting them decide their own gender despite clear morphological and anatomical reality, dozens of pronouns etc. this is obviously dangerous and destructive

thinkingman:
you rearranged the argument for your own benefit. i maintain that the despair of gender conflicted youth is not due to outside bullying, pressure… it may be worsened by it i will concede that, but it is not the cause
the left encourages kids to be even more gender conflicted with their attitudes toward gender fluidity, spectrum, letting them decide their own gender despite clear morphological and anatomical reality, dozens of pronouns etc. this is obviously dangerous and destructive
Yet this is contrary to studies and the consensus of psychiatric professionals. Where is your evidence that discouraging transgender acceptance and encouraging the suppression of transgender feelings will decrease suicide and self-harm among these populations?

mobulis:

thinkingman:
you rearranged the argument for your own benefit. i maintain that the despair of gender conflicted youth is not due to outside bullying, pressure… it may be worsened by it i will concede that, but it is not the cause
the left encourages kids to be even more gender conflicted with their attitudes toward gender fluidity, spectrum, letting them decide their own gender despite clear morphological and anatomical reality, dozens of pronouns etc. this is obviously dangerous and destructive
Evidence says otherwise.
yeah sure 40% suicide rate vs like 5%
where did i say that “ discouraging transgender acceptance and encouraging the suppression of transgender feelings will decrease suicide ?”
That’s the alternative to what the professionals and those who consider themselves pro-transgender rights advocate. If that’s not what you think should be the reaction to someone having these feelings, what do you think the reaction should be when someone is questioning their assigned gender?
i am not a therapist. but i doubt assigning a dozen made up bizarre pronouns, genders with symbols, feeding them chemicals and encouraging mutilating surgery is the answer

fallenturtle:
What’s the 5% from?
baseline suicide rate of those not wondering what gender they are

AlexMcAlpine:
Why is this in Politics?
because it has become part of the political agenda of the looney left