Another our bad wrong address

[WuWei]

You’re wrong. And it wasn’t a “firefight.” It was the murder of an innocent citizen in the door of his own home.

[SixFoot]

@TheRedComet

That citizen had every right to answer his door armed.

That cop’s ■■■■ got hard when he killed that guy. Prove me wrong, then ask how I know.

[Samm]

@Gaius

@Smyrna

The second was the homeowner coming out with a gun.

Coming out with and raising the gun.

That should not be a death sentence, but, given that he raised his gun before/without uttering a word, I am not surprised that the at the cops’
“shoot first and ask questions later” response.

What I saw was the man bringing his “gun to the ready.” It was not pointed at the officer who shot him. While it’s impossible to put oneself in the officer’s mind, knowing that he was at the wrong address (which he did) at that moment, it would seem like the first reaction should have been to take a step back behind the cover of the corner of the house and call out to him rather than to shoot him simply because he had a gun when he knew that the man was not the subject of the 911 call.

This shoot first and ask questions later attitude seems to be endemic in police departments these days. Give all of these tragic incidents, one has to wonder why that is.

[Bosun]

Well it started with a 911 domestic violence call. A very dangerous call that ends unexpectedly. Officers arrive a wrong house. A guy steps out with a gun. Officers instantaneously responded with Deadly force. Wife may have started shooting. Glad she did not get killed. The 911 perp across the street can DV again. The officers have to live with the death of an armed but innocent civilian. A lot of people have been affected by this tragedy.

[Samm]

@W_and_C

@TheRedComet

@Smyrna

It sounds like the officer that knocked…was just pointed out by his partner that they were at the wrong house. That was mistake number one. The second was the homeowner coming out with a gun. I’m an outsider looking in but concluding you should come out brandishing a weapon before fully giving yourself a chance to understand if the situation warrants it…placed those officers in a precarious, life threatening situation.

We are citizens not subjects.

That citizen had every right to answer his door armed.

But is it a smart thing to do ?

It doesn’t matter, it’s our right. We should not be killed for availing ourselves of a right even if someone else thinks doing so was “not smart”? What right does a policeman have to shoot you for doing something that is within your rights any more than if it were me pounding on your door late at night. Could I get away with shooting you too?

[Bosun]

It does matter. The train wreck started with a 911 domestic violence call.

Innocent people did not have good situational awareness.

[Samm]

@Gaius

(They would not have had body cams.)

They’d go to jail.

They would go to jail either way. Do you think a pizza deliveryman say wearing a body cam would get away for killing someone if he knocked on the wrong door and the occupant opened the door with a gun in his hand? Cops are civilians who must abide by the same laws as you and I do. The badge gives them the authority to enforce the law, not to break it.

[Bosun]

Samm lets go have a beer. Maybe watch the Northern Lights or take photos of eagles

[W_and_C]

@Samm

@W_and_C

@TheRedComet

@Smyrna

It sounds like the officer that knocked…was just pointed out by his partner that they were at the wrong house. That was mistake number one. The second was the homeowner coming out with a gun. I’m an outsider looking in but concluding you should come out brandishing a weapon before fully giving yourself a chance to understand if the situation warrants it…placed those officers in a precarious, life threatening situation.

We are citizens not subjects.

That citizen had every right to answer his door armed.

But is it a smart thing to do ?

It doesn’t matter, it’s our right. We should not be killed for availing ourselves of a right even if someone else thinks doing so was “not smart”? What right does a policeman have to shoot you for doing something that is within your rights any more than if it were me pounding on your door late at night. Could I get away with shooting you too?

Well. It matters only if self-preservation is an instinct that you possess.

From legal point of view, I think you are right, or at least have a strong case here - i.e. this gentleman was entitled to answer his door armed.

But there’s legal, and there’s good old-fashioned common sense. Like @Smyrna was saying, drawing your weapon upon coming to the door without apparently knowing what the hell was going on is ridiculously stupid, legal or not.

And now because common sense wasn’t applied here, this guy’s kids won’t have a father.

[Samm]

@WuWei

I love how these stories grow with each telling “raised the gun”.

They shot because they saw a gun.

It is not illegal to be armed in this country.

Exactly.

[Samm]

@Bosun

The 911 call for a domestic violence got the tragedy started.

Even cops should know that houses with odd numbers are on the opposite side of the street from the houses with even numbers.

[Supreme_War_Pig]

@W_and_C

drawing your weapon upon coming to the door without apparently knowing what the hell was going on is ridiculously stupid, legal or not.

Disagree. If he doesn’t know what is going on, he needs to be able to react immediately.

Instead of stupid would you accept “risky”?

[Samm]

@Bosun

The wife may have shot at them. This firefight was tragedy.

You gotta admire her courage. It would take a lot of guts to pick up your dead spouse’s gun and start shooting back at the assailants.

[Samm]

@Bosun

It does matter. The train wreck started with a 911 domestic violence call.

Innocent people did not have good situational awareness.

No, that part was routine. The train wreck started with the police going to the wrong house and beating on the door.

[Bosun]

You know what latte to order at Starbucks. Peace and love. Go visit Disneyland. Have a safe day.

[W_and_C]

@Supreme_War_Pig

@W_and_C

drawing your weapon upon coming to the door without apparently knowing what the hell was going on is ridiculously stupid, legal or not.

Disagree. If he doesn’t know what is going on, he needs to be able to react immediately.

Instead of stupid would you accept “risky”?

Very risky. I’d say have the weapon on you or within reach but not draw coming out the door.

[Samm]

@W_and_C

@Samm

@W_and_C

@TheRedComet

@Smyrna

It sounds like the officer that knocked…was just pointed out by his partner that they were at the wrong house. That was mistake number one. The second was the homeowner coming out with a gun. I’m an outsider looking in but concluding you should come out brandishing a weapon before fully giving yourself a chance to understand if the situation warrants it…placed those officers in a precarious, life threatening situation.

We are citizens not subjects.

That citizen had every right to answer his door armed.

But is it a smart thing to do ?

It doesn’t matter, it’s our right. We should not be killed for availing ourselves of a right even if someone else thinks doing so was “not smart”? What right does a policeman have to shoot you for doing something that is within your rights any more than if it were me pounding on your door late at night. Could I get away with shooting you too?

Well. It matters only if self-preservation is an instinct that you possess.

From legal point of view, I think you are right, or at least have a strong case here - i.e. this gentleman was entitled to answer his door armed.

But there’s legal, and there’s good old-fashioned common sense. Like @Smyrna was saying, drawing your weapon upon coming to the door without apparently knowing what the hell was going on is ridiculously stupid, legal or not.

And now because common sense wasn’t applied here, this guy’s kids won’t have a father.

No! Coming to your door armed and prepared to deal with a potential home invader is not a stupid thing to do.

[Samm]

@Supreme_War_Pig

@W_and_C

drawing your weapon upon coming to the door without apparently knowing what the hell was going on is ridiculously stupid, legal or not.

Disagree. If he doesn’t know what is going on, he needs to be able to react immediately.

Instead of stupid would you accept “risky”?

What’s going on here? You’re sounding quite rational about this.

[floydefisher]

So what is the homeowner supposed to do? Come to the door unarmed and pray it’s not a home invasion in progress?

This is a situation where neither side is right or wrong. Police have the right to defend themselves here, as does the homeowner.

The only way to fix this, is to force one side or the other to become a sacrificial lamb. Exactly who should be sacrificed for the other?

[Samm]

@W_and_C

@Supreme_War_Pig

@W_and_C

drawing your weapon upon coming to the door without apparently knowing what the hell was going on is ridiculously stupid, legal or not.

Disagree. If he doesn’t know what is going on, he needs to be able to react immediately.

Instead of stupid would you accept “risky”?

Very risky. I’d say have the weapon on you or within reach but not draw coming out the door.

Risk is inherent when facing an unknown situation that is potentially violent (as someone pounding on your door late in the evening is.) Stupid is not being prepared to deal with that risk.

What if the first thing you see when you open the door is the bore of a gun? Will you be able to draw and fire your gun before they shoot you? The silly things you guys © say sometimes. …