5900

Every American citizen including POTUS is individually entitled to opine on most anything peacefully including election fraud concerns. Over the years many elected officials on both sides of the isle have taken liberties in protesting Presidential election results too. Even some tested “unproven” narratives knowingly they are likely not true in the equation too. It is what it is, that is, dirty politics. Moving on…

5901

Of course not. Everyone is welcome here. Just making clearer this is the election fraud thread is all.

5902

And yet you brought up gun crimes on January 6th and a rioter that got shoot trying to get at members of Congress and the VP.

Neither of which has to do with election fraud.

WW

5903

don’t forget Hunter’s soggy laptop as well…

5904

[quote=“enki, post:5903, topic:237765, full:true”]

I rarely reply to anyone who is not on topic. That being said, I am far from perfect…

5905

Yes. That is why I am reluctant to embrace legislation coming out of these dirty politics.

Happy to move on too. My focus is on actual election fraud in 2020 and the question of has it occurred or not.

1 Like
5906

So you mean still open for discussion does the degree rise to the level of being systemic?

Sad to think even if massive fraud is proven Biden remains. After all, no practical way to impeach /convict/remove him, during his remaining term, especially with the Senate currently needing 67 votes to remove a sitting POTUS. Then the flip side of that coin is currently (continued) attempts to disqualify Trump from ever running again. Dirty politics just getting dirtier by the day. Go figure…

5907

If massive fraud is proven I think impeachment is likely if not inevitable.

I don’t hear any “D” I know saying that they are aware of fraud and don’t care because Biden won. And I certainly don’t feel that way.

If massive fraud is proven I don’t see much problem getting majority or super-majority support to correct the outcome.

5908

I am open for either. If there is a tiny fraud it is interesting to me.

I am naturally more interested in hearing the case that there was “massive fraud”. By my scorecard those claims have not evened settled on what the mechanism was … much less putting forth supporting evidence for it.

Just “what if’s”, “must be’s” and accusations that I don’t want to look at the evidence.

5909

It will not surprise me in the least if the Congress turns red in 2023. But for as tempting serving up Articles of Impeachment against Biden might be, I hope the Republicans do not move forward on most anything including even should systematic fraud be proven. After all, what’s the point, especially when a Senate conviction will never happen at least in my humble opinion.

5910

Have you been following this complaint?

In a nutshell the complaint want Supreme Court to consider-reconsider whether certain States have standing. Something to do with the 12th Amendment and citing that massive evidence is being suppressed through America in enough states that if proven Biden would not have 270 electoral votes.

This includes:

AZ - Maricopa County forensic audit revealing certain info not furnished from subpoena
GA- Fulton County destroying voting materials
MI- Signatures not always verified in accordance with election law with mail in ballots
PA- Delaware County video admitting and caught in the act
WI- 50,000 registered voter roll mismatches

Over the holiday weekend, Lindell sponsored a 4 day symposium where over 200,000 emails were sent out by citizens to many AG’s throughout America.

Certainly a grass roots movement, bottoms up kind of thing for We the People is brewing…

https://frankspeech.com/video/kurt-olsen-summarizes-us-supreme-court-complaint

5911

I’ve stopped following every detail of the Lindell effort… and here is why.

His techniques minimizes the chances of legal success in order to maximize the interests of his public audience.

He has shown again and again that his evidence and promises fall far short of what he claims them to be.

I honestly don’t think this a serious attempt at winning a legal case. Rather this is an entertainment product designed to keep your interest, energize you to support R’s and make $$$ for the producers.

Lindell had promised a Supreme Court case filing in Nov 24… when that day came he effectively ran a pillow commercial.

I look forward to any of these cases making it to a court because the court enforces rules and structures that tend to bring forth the truth.

But honestly I don’t think these efforts are designed to have a case heard in a court of law. They are designed to captivate you and engender your political and financial support.

Here is a case that illustrates my point. This is a ruling against some shucksters that took donations to launch a case… look at the judges findings here… they took the $$$ but did absolutely nothing to develop their case. Just filed it and siphoned $$$ from donors.

https://www.courthousenews.com/wp-content/uploads/2021/04/Dominion-Dismissal.pdf

That was the case, this is the sanction by the judge calling out the lawyers for running a scam case to fleece donors:

https://www.documentcloud.org/documents/21049123-parker-decision-on-lawyer-sanctions

Edit. Actually these are different cases. Leaving the links because they both illustrate my point. This far the cases filed have been unserious, frivolous legal attempts. They generate excitement and interest of the public, but are not really serious attempts to articulate a fraud allegation in court.

2 Likes
5912

I thought a 82 page claim was something that would of peaked your curiosity.

Or what the buzz was with emails being sent by 200,000 people who tuned into Lindell at some point this past weekend.

Oh well, like the proverb goes “you can lead a horse to water, but you can’t make it drink”…

5913

It would be. I can’t find it. I googled the lawyers name and case keywords. All I get are entertainment sites with this interview and ads asking for $$$.

Do you have a link to the filing?

5914

Nothing to drink. They have not filed the case and are not posting the compliant.

It is ALL lead and NO water.

Can you provide the water?

Edit: I found the complaint

https://cdn.michaeljlindell.com/downloads/fix2020first/states-v-us-and-states-compl-2021-11-23.pdf

5915

I also gave you a link to the 9 minute audio recap earlier.

5916

I found the complaint. I’ll take my info from there.

First thing I noticed is actually not a compliant there are filing…

It is in the format of a compliant that they are asking viewers to email out to states AG to file?

Why aren’t the just filing it already? What’s with all the manicures that keep this out of court rather than in court.

Just file the damn thing.

5917

I believe it has something to do with how the Supreme Court might ultimately give states standing.

For now people are being encouraged to contact their respective AG’s which is customary when there are election concerns.

And believe it or not, according to Lindell there are still several Attorney General’s who claim they are still in the dark on some things concerning evidence potentially being suppressed without their knowledge. Go figure…

5918

I believe it. The closer these claims get to structured legal examination, the more reluctant people are to participate.

I read over the “complaint” quickly. It is not possible to address every item here, but here are my impressions:

Never ever ever does it claim (*) fraudulent votes… except by misrepresenting the AZ audit and other reports that claim “potentially fraudulent votes”. I’m actually pretty miffed that they drop the “potential” from the AZ audit and just state that it found fraudulent votes. That is a material mis-representation.

I starred (*) my last comment because they characterize ballots from legitimate voters associated with a rule violation as fraudulent. As discussed many times the remedy for a rule violation is not to disenfranchise the voter. Even if the court agrees with every one of these claimed rule violations (unlikely in my opinion) … the correct remedy is not to set aside the result. The votes will count and the court will make orders to restore the original rules.

Another category of claims are “potential for fraud” … like having things connected to the internet. Even if all the claims are true, without fraud having actually occurred the court will not and should not set aside the result. Similar to how my insurance company does not pay me for lost items when I leave my door unlocked, but can not show any theft.

The final category is the non-cooperation of various parties to various investigations. The relief requested does not match these complaints. If they want to adjudicate cooperation that should be it’s own compliant. Non-cooperation does not translate to “invalid election”

To sum up my impression, this is a kitchen sink, Swiss Army knife compliant. I don’t see it well designed to have success in a legal proceeding. It does match well with my earlier comment that these are designed to entertain and engage the public rather than pass muster in a legal proceeding.

In that light it makes sense that they are not filing this on their own but rather pushing into the public.

I think they shoot themselves in the foot by including so many frivolous items in the complaint. State AG’s are not going to put themselves out there by filing bad faith complaints. If they believe in the big ticket legal disputes they should file them stand-alone and match the relief to the issue.

Is there any specific item in the claim you want to delve into where you think an honest court will award the relief requested and “undo” the results?

PS: pillow code PATRIOT-SOFTEST… 60% off! Best night sleep ever made in America buy slippers and mattress too. Donate. Towels.

:wink:

3 Likes
5919

Could be the case, but this guy lindell is wearing thin with all these special excuses for not meeting his promises.

Starting to sound a lot like the guy that just needs another month to have his third party settlement check clear and then get the title fixed up because the DMV mistake but then his brother has the car and can drive it here but his phone is broke and he’s in the Army.

If you know what I mean.